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Charlemagne Allen · 08-05-2008, 04:55 PM

My concern is that they'll conceive PG in very small terms and force people to put all their poseballs in Mature sims, even if they're inside. Then, we'll see entire sims full of Xcite-laden skyboxes.

**Sarah Nerd** · 08-05-2008, 04:59 PM

I get the impression this means new sims may be zoned residential and commercial. He's been talking about changes coming to the ad farm problem for weeks at his office hours. I'm glad it's finally getting closer to being more than just talk. I haven't posted any legit response to the offical thread because Ancient Shriner just posted his ass kissing lying bullshit and I know if I post in the next few minutes it will be to call him out so I'll be good.

Quote:

Ancient Shriner
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 22

Thumbs up TAG Supports Zoning
The Advertisers Guild wishes to send hearty congratulations to Linden Lab for working out a winning solution. We're thrilled that we'll have a venue for legitimate advertising and we wish to work with Linden Lab to conform to the new rules as soon as possible. If that means whole swathes of the network need to be eliminated and re-established elsewhere, so be it.

Also, a specific thank you to Jack Linden for his great patience and fairness.

Eirik · 08-05-2008, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlipperPA Peregrine

Let's also not forget:

There's a big difference between a shop / boutique and a mall. I've always hated main land malls, but I don't have a problem with people having a primary shop... just nothing taking up a full sim!

As long as the mall is well built, what's the problem? I don't see the difference between an ugly mall and an ugly residence versus a good looking mall or good looking residence.

Cocoanut Koala · 08-05-2008, 05:04 PM

Ancient Shriner has got to be . . .

Well anyway, I notice someone on the official forums has suggested maybe this is preparatory to raising mainland fees.

coco

FlipperPA Peregrine · 08-05-2008, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cocoanut Koala

Wait now. I hope my shop WILL fill up a full sim one day. (God knows, I'm already paying for it to.)

But if you had a shop that could fill a sim, would it make sense to buy an island - or make sure the entire mainland sim you already own is zoned commercial?

There are no easy answers, but a mainland sim fully owned should be able to be zoned any way the single owner wants, pretty much.

Other than that, there could be mixed sims, and residential, which are self explanatory.

Most of my ideas are pie-in-the-sky, but I tried to stick to ideas that could be automated through the software. LL is good with automated stuff. It is the rest they've traditionally fallen down on. Has anyone ever had a problem with autoreturn?

Regards,

-Flip

Dnate Mars · 08-05-2008, 05:08 PM

All I know is that they better not rezone my sim on me. I like it just the way it is.

Cocoanut Koala · 08-05-2008, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlipperPA Peregrine

But if you had a shop that could fill a sim, would it make sense to buy an island - or make sure the entire mainland sim you already own is zoned commercial?

Well, of course it would make sense to buy an island.

If I had 1000 or so to spare.

And could afford 295 a month instead of 195 a month.

And hadn't spent two years gradually expanding my shop in Rosieri.

And didn't like the mainland.

Now, does it make sense to make me have to leave my nest in Rosieri? Sell it at a loss, maybe, or just abandon it?

Well, there I would STILL have to come up with 1k for an island (or is it more?) and would still have to pay 295 tier instead of 195. (If I'm understanding that right.)

I'm pretty sure LL thinks it would make sense. it would make sense to them for at least one reason - one less resident business.

Which will doubtless be what happens when they decide a few motions in the direction of improvement will justify raising them to the tier cost of islands, even though you don't have nearly the control over them.

I don't own that mainland sim solely, so I would presumably not have any say in how it is zoned. Anyhow, I don't think they are going to do that to people. Reading over Jack's post again, it sounded like they were talking about NEW land.*

coco

P.S. On page two of the forums discussion, I notice that a lot of people unfortunately seem to think this means getting RID of ad farmers. And/or all ads.

*apparently this is the case, since I just read Jack's comment: "The question of how this affects existing Mainland is a good one. Clearly changes we make re. advertising will impact the current Mainland regions, but with Zoning it is more complex and initially it's unlikely we will try to retrospectively Zone old regions. As one person points out, suddenly moving the goalposts in that way is difficult. Now it *may* be that one day we allow existing regions to opt in to Zoning if all owners there agree, but we shall see how feasible that is as we get closer to new regions being Zoned."

Walker · 08-05-2008, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cocoanut Koala

They suspended Stankleberry? Is he still suspended?

coco

I don't think so. I'm pretty sure I've seen pics of him in the Second Life picture thread recently... and I think Jessy would have mentioned it if he was.

(I hope I haven't got my facts wrong btw.

)

Khamon · 08-05-2008, 05:26 PM

There's a marked difference between a sim full of houses for sale, with walkways and mailboxes and trees about to make the place inviting, and a sim sized box of boxes full of rental boxes of boxes. Non-commercial zoning accomplishes nothing as "residential" establishments can just easily be megaprim boxes of boxes of boxes that impose far more intensive scripting on the sim than the average shop.

Yes to land sim controls for group that own the entire sim, or all but the Linden land in the sim, or even by vote per sm ownership in the sim. I readed it all btw and didn't eat a byte.

NeoBokrug Elytis · 08-05-2008, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fade Languish

...you could end up with it being some sort of wasteland. (Or more so in some cases).

I take offense to that good sir, we shall duel with pistols at dawn!

Mainland covenants! OH WOW!

I wonder if LL will slowly buy-out mainland sims in order to rezone them, or even wait until they're abandoned when people flood to the covenant ruled mainland sims. Either way the land market is going to get very interesting.

Oh, and the adfarmers who are all

, you had it coming. If you could put up attractive non intrusive billboards, and cooperated with neighbors on a regular basis, I might care a little.

Aki Shichiroji · 08-05-2008, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeoBokrug Elytis

Oh, and the adfarmers who are all

, you had it coming. If you could put up attractive non intrusive billboards, and cooperated with neighbors on a regular basis, I might care a little.

For such adfarmers, it was never about working with neighbors. it was all about creating an eyesore and charging money for getting rid of it. Asking them not to would be like asking a tiger to change its stripes.

Khamon · 08-05-2008, 05:33 PM

Put me on record here, as I will not post to the official forums under any circumstances, as believing the moving goalpost argument complete and utter bullshit. Linden Lab have moved goalposts around since 2003, at least the ones they've actually finished building in the first place.

Considering the past five years, that hollow reasoning just simply doesn't wash.

Fade Languish · 08-05-2008, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeoBokrug Elytis

I take offense to that good sir, we shall duel with pistols at dawn!

If only it was your kind of wasteland. I've visited, and it's amazing.

Oh, and

Cocoanut Koala · 08-05-2008, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Khamon

Put me on record here, as I will not post to the official forums under any circumstances, as believing the moving goalpost argument complete and utter bullshit. Linden Lab have moved goalposts around since 2003, at least the ones they've actually finished building in the first place.

Considering the past five years, that hollow reasoning just simply doesn't wash.

Well it does, if it means some Linden will arbitrary zone Rosieri as "residential," see.

coco

Cocoanut Koala · 08-05-2008, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anya Ristow

I take it to mean the companies, educational institutions and government entities aren't rushing in in the numbers LL wants, so they've wisely decided they can't bet the farm on them and will instead start giving residents what they want, because residents are already giving them merry bundles of cash, now, not at some mystical future date of corporate bliss.

Well, I guess that's one way of looking at it. However, I'm not inclined to look at it that way.

coco

P.S. Post number 137 figured out about Coke and Nike.

Walker · 08-05-2008, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cocoanut Koala

Well anyway, I notice someone on the official forums has suggested maybe this is preparatory to raising mainland fees.

Would that be wise, given current (RL) economic conditions?

I'm not sure how recession worries affect MMOG based services.

Macphisto Angelus · 08-05-2008, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walker Moore

Would that be wise, given current (RL) economic conditions?

I'm not sure how recession worries affect MMOG based services.

Walker still questions if an LL decision can be gauged on the "wise" scale.

Fade Languish · 08-05-2008, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walker Moore

Would that be wise, given current (RL) economic conditions?

I'm not sure how recession worries affect MMOG based services.

I don't think it would be wise regardless. They need to create all the goodwill they can get, because they are in deficit. They need to give, not take with this one.

**Sarah Nerd** · 08-05-2008, 06:13 PM

You should hear those piece of shit ad farmers at Jack's office hours. They kiss his ass, and do everything possible to make themselves seem like valued members of the community. Makes me sick.

Ray Figtree · 08-05-2008, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dnate Mars

All I know is that they better not rezone my sim on me. I like it just the way it is.

They won't be zoning or rezoning existing sims. Existing mainland won't be affected.

This is them letting us know there are more Bay City style or other theme sims coming, this time with zoning.

**Lily Joliat** · 08-05-2008, 07:27 PM

Does that mean they will ignore the problems in the existing sims or just concentrate on new ones they can charge a lot more for with better zoning?

Vialli Rossini · 08-05-2008, 09:08 PM

This sounds very much like "churning business" to me. But in the main companies tend to churn another companies customer base...in this case it seems LL are going to churn their own customers!! Incredible........dump zoned mainland on the grid, devalue existing mainland.......people dump their land quick and grab a piece of the new.....churn succesful!!
Resident numbers are not going up...so how do LL get more juice out of the lemon?

Of course...there is also the possibility that tier for the new zoned land might be made the same as Estate.

It's like watching America's Got Talent.....you never know what lunatic is going to do what!!

Ray Figtree · 08-05-2008, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vialli Rossini

This sounds very much like "churning business" to me. But in the main companies tend to churn another companies customer base...in this case it seems LL are going to churn their own customers!! Incredible........dump zoned mainland on the grid, devalue existing mainland.......people dump their land quick and grab a piece of the new.....churn succesful!!
Resident numbers are not going up...so how do LL get more juice out of the lemon?

Of course...there is also the possibility that tier for the new zoned land might be made the same as Estate.

It's like watching America's Got Talent.....you never know what lunatic is going to do what!!

They've had to rely on churn since mid last year when the number of new members fell off the chart.

This was inevitable given that LL watched throngs of people bidding up the Bay City plots. These new ones will fetch even more at auction. People will pay a huge premium for insurance against ad farms. Throw in themed and well-thought out terra and you've got another feeding frenzy on the horizon.

Winter Ventura · 08-05-2008, 09:40 PM

in all honnesty, I think "people" are more willing to 'rent" (buy" from LL on a themed sim (let's say steampunk) then they would be to take a risk on a private owner. While there are a few reputable estate owners, we've ALL heard the horror stories about landlords taking the money, then banning the person and muting them.

At the same time, I don't think I'd feel comfortable buying "zoned" land from LL.. much like buying PG.. I don't want to fall afoul of the people who allow me to access my account, just because I did something that someone felt wasn't within the theme.

Khamon · 08-06-2008, 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cocoanut Koala

Well it does, if it means some Linden will arbitrary zone Rosieri as "residential," see.

No, it doesn't, to them. They've been arbitrarily making less radical changes than that, for the good of the order, since I've been here, there, inworld, you know what I mean, see?

08-05-2008, 04:55 PM	#26 (permalink)
Charlemagne Allen Countess of Darkmere Heaven, to keep its beauty, cast them out, but even Hell itself would not receive them for fear the wicked there might glory over them. Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: USA Posts: 5,393 My Mood: SL Join Date: February 2007 Blog Entries: 1	My concern is that they'll conceive PG in very small terms and force people to put all their poseballs in Mature sims, even if they're inside. Then, we'll see entire sims full of Xcite-laden skyboxes. __________________ Charlemagne Allen: YOU'RE A RACIST! Charlemagne Allen: I HAVE CHATLOGS! smokergirl Lowenhar: HOMOPHOBE smokergirl Lowenhar: CONTENT THIEF Charlemagne Allen: RELIGION SUCKS DONKEY BALLS! smokergirl Lowenhar: KISS MY ASS YOU CLOSE MINDED HYPOCRIT Charlemagne Allen: YOU WERE AN ESCORT FOR BARN ANIMALS! Charlemagne Allen: ZOMG BIG SIG! Pretty things: http://www.flickr.com/photos/charlemagneallen/

08-05-2008, 05:04 PM	#29 (permalink)
Cocoanut Koala Coco's Cottages There is no sanctuary. You may think there is, but there isn't. Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 8,384 SLShopper Ads: 8 Business: Coco's Cottages Awards: 1	Ancient Shriner has got to be . . . Well anyway, I notice someone on the official forums has suggested maybe this is preparatory to raising mainland fees. coco __________________ ~ Coco's Cottages ~ Rosieri 87,165,88 Newest Addition: SNOWY WOODS COTTAGE ~from the 512 Collection~

08-05-2008, 05:08 PM	#31 (permalink)
Dnate Mars Tastes like purple Illyngophiliac Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Home Posts: 10,885 My Mood: Wordtris Champion! SL Join Date: 01/27/2004 Business: Scripter for hire XBOX Leaderboard: 36^th	All I know is that they better not rezone my sim on me. I like it just the way it is. __________________ SLU Clubhouse - Open 24/7 Visit at http://slurl.com/secondlife/Tan/138/25/25

08-05-2008, 05:26 PM	#34 (permalink)
Khamon BUY TREES MOAR1 Iz a timeout Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Alabama Posts: 4,819 My Mood: SLShopper Ads: 2 SL Join Date: November, 2003 Business: Fate Gardens Flowers and Trees	There's a marked difference between a sim full of houses for sale, with walkways and mailboxes and trees about to make the place inviting, and a sim sized box of boxes full of rental boxes of boxes. Non-commercial zoning accomplishes nothing as "residential" establishments can just easily be megaprim boxes of boxes of boxes that impose far more intensive scripting on the sim than the average shop. Yes to land sim controls for group that own the entire sim, or all but the Linden land in the sim, or even by vote per sm ownership in the sim. I readed it all btw and didn't eat a byte. __________________ But of bliss and glad life there is little to be said, before it ends; as works fair and wonderful, while still they endure for eyes to see, are their own record, and only when they are in peril or broken for ever do they pass into song. - Quenta Silmarillion Please Visit Our Gardens and Our Website Last edited by Khamon; 08-06-2008 at 01:32 AM.

08-05-2008, 07:27 PM	#46 (permalink)
Lily Joliat Like Totally SLU Supporter Just Here Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Vista, CA Posts: 4,371 My Mood: SL Join Date: 7/22/06 Blog Entries: 6	Does that mean they will ignore the problems in the existing sims or just concentrate on new ones they can charge a lot more for with better zoning? __________________ Food Porn: http://www.flickr.com/photos/wildoneilb/

08-05-2008, 05:33 PM	#37 (permalink)
Khamon BUY TREES MOAR1 Iz a timeout Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Alabama Posts: 4,819 My Mood: SLShopper Ads: 2 SL Join Date: November, 2003 Business: Fate Gardens Flowers and Trees	Put me on record here, as I will not post to the official forums under any circumstances, as believing the moving goalpost argument complete and utter bullshit. Linden Lab have moved goalposts around since 2003, at least the ones they've actually finished building in the first place. Considering the past five years, that hollow reasoning just simply doesn't wash.

08-05-2008, 06:13 PM	#44 (permalink)
Sarah Nerd I BUY LAND SLU Supporter Still floating around the interwebz Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: O-hi-o! Posts: 9,260 My Mood: Harpoon Lagoon Champion! SLShopper Ads: 2 SL Join Date: August 05 Awards: 2	You should hear those piece of shit ad farmers at Jack's office hours. They kiss his ass, and do everything possible to make themselves seem like valued members of the community. Makes me sick.

08-05-2008, 09:08 PM	#47 (permalink)
Vialli Rossini Senior Member Here! Join Date: May 2008 Location: UK Posts: 105 My Mood:	This sounds very much like "churning business" to me. But in the main companies tend to churn another companies customer base...in this case it seems LL are going to churn their own customers!! Incredible........dump zoned mainland on the grid, devalue existing mainland.......people dump their land quick and grab a piece of the new.....churn succesful!! Resident numbers are not going up...so how do LL get more juice out of the lemon? Of course...there is also the possibility that tier for the new zoned land might be made the same as Estate. It's like watching America's Got Talent.....you never know what lunatic is going to do what!!

08-05-2008, 09:40 PM	#49 (permalink)
Winter Ventura Eclectic Randomness Predictable Experience Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Pod Six Posts: 1,193 My Mood: SLShopper Ads: 5 SL Join Date: 7/13/2006 Business: Eclectic Randomness	in all honnesty, I think "people" are more willing to 'rent" (buy" from LL on a themed sim (let's say steampunk) then they would be to take a risk on a private owner. While there are a few reputable estate owners, we've ALL heard the horror stories about landlords taking the money, then banning the person and muting them. At the same time, I don't think I'd feel comfortable buying "zoned" land from LL.. much like buying PG.. I don't want to fall afoul of the people who allow me to access my account, just because I did something that someone felt wasn't within the theme. __________________ Inworld Store: http://slurl.eclectic-randomness.com Website: http://www.eclectic-randomness.com Twitter: WinterVentura

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