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**Bard Jameson** · 05-30-2008, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quantum Destiny

Well, yeah. Obviously the healthcare. I mean, the healthcare goes without saying, doesn't it? But apart from the plumbing,
the chocolate, the wi-fi and the healthcare, what has modern civilization done for us?

Brought peace?

Peace? Oh shut up!

Atia · 05-30-2008, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bard Jameson

Can't go along with you there, friend...being a man of and in my own times. The list of what I would miss would be quite long, starting with indoor plumbing and ending up somewhere around chocolate chip ice cream

But imagine the feeling of your boys being free while you lie on a bed of leaves smoking your favorite herb? Top that off with a woman whose only desire is to feed you and further populate the tribe. And you want ice cream? You've been out of the jungle too long, babe.

Walker · 05-30-2008, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atia

I think it's great *modern* man hasn't totally raped the planet. A agree wth your mom - leave these people alone. I'm sure they're quite happy with their lot. They don't need anyone coming in and corrupting their lifestyle and traditions.

But how do we know? How do we know they're really happy with their lot? We see men with bows, and obviously they're capable of hunting for food and sustaining themselves, but who knows what their culture is like, how they treat their women and children and what hardships they endure with no medicine, such poor shelter, and the threats they presumably face from wildlife and neighbouring tribes.

I just wonder if we have a duty to introduce isolated tribes like this to the rest of the civilised world (even if it must be done slowly over many generations), to improve their living conditions, and ensure their health and welfare are satisfactory because I'd hate to think we're turning a blind eye to humans living in misery just for the sake of preserving them like they're an endangered species.

**Bard Jameson** · 05-30-2008, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walker Moore

But how do we know? How do we know they're really happy with their lot? We see men with bows, and obviously they're capable of hunting for food and sustaining themselves, but who knows what their culture is like, how they treat their women and children and what hardships they endure with no medicine, such poor shelter, and the threats they presumably face from wildlife and neighbouring tribes.

I just wonder if we have a duty to introduce isolated tribes like this to the rest of the civilised world (even if it must be done slowly over many generations), to improve their living conditions, and ensure their health and welfare are satisfactory because I'd hate to think we're turning a blind eye to humans living in misery just for the sake of preserving them like they're an endangered species.

Worked well in America's westward expansion...why not?

**Bard Jameson** · 05-30-2008, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atia

But imagine the feeling of your boys being free while you lie on a bed of leaves smoking your favorite herb? Top that off with a woman whose only desire is to feed you and further populate the tribe. And you want ice cream? You've been out of the jungle too long, babe.

You just outlined our next in-world RP...

Quantum Destiny · 05-30-2008, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walker Moore

But how do we know? How do we know they're really happy with their lot? We see men with bows, and obviously they're capable of hunting for food and sustaining themselves, but who knows what their culture is like, how they treat their women and children and what hardships they endure with no medicine, such poor shelter, and the threats they presumably face from wildlife and neighbouring tribes.

I just wonder if we have a duty to introduce isolated tribes like this to the rest of the civilised world (even if it must be done slowly over many generations), to improve their living conditions, and ensure their health and welfare are satisfactory because I'd hate to think we're turning a blind eye to humans living in misery just for the sake of preserving them like they're an endangered species.

Watch Star Trek, damnit!

Lucifer Baphomet · 05-30-2008, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quantum Destiny

Watch Star Trek, damnit!

Refers Mr Destiny to post #10

Joshua Nightshade · 05-30-2008, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lucifer Baphomet

Refers Mr Destiny to post #10

I wonder why Lucifer hasn't contributed to this thread, this seems like something he would talk about....

Trout Recreant · 05-30-2008, 05:36 PM

Liquor. I can't believe these people have made it so long without good bourbon. And porn. Definitely need to get them up to date on porn. We could teach them to gamble as well.

Other than that, there isn't much they need. Maybe some ice for the bourbon - it's hot in the jungle.

Atia · 05-30-2008, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walker Moore

But how do we know? How do we know they're really happy with their lot? We see men with bows, and obviously they're capable of hunting for food and sustaining themselves, but who knows what their culture is like, how they treat their women and children and what hardships they endure with no medicine, such poor shelter, and the threats they presumably face from wildlife and neighbouring tribes.

I just wonder if we have a duty to introduce isolated tribes like this to the rest of the civilised world (even if it must be done slowly over many generations), to improve their living conditions, and ensure their health and welfare are satisfactory because I'd hate to think we're turning a blind eye to humans living in misery just for the sake of preserving them like they're an endangered species.

I feel it bit presumptuous to assume what our highly-developed civilization has to offer would make another culture happy or happier than they currently are. I've seen a few documentaries and read a book or two suggesting that isolation of this type is not a recipe for extinction or unhappiness. In fact, quite the contrary.

Too often a sense of *duty* to rescue or save (read CHANGE) another culture has not brought happiness at all but instead has created misery, perpetual discontentment and loss of cultural identity, history and language. One only has to look at Native American tribes to see how well THAT experiment went.

Tussilago · 05-30-2008, 06:02 PM

You all sound like aliens discussing humanity.

**Vertigo Paris** · 05-30-2008, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tussilago

You all sound like aliens discussing humanity.

The anal probage is next.

Stormy Dyrssen · 05-30-2008, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quantum Destiny

I kind of envy them actually.

I think the only things I would miss from our civilization are music and books.

My sentiments exactly!

Think they would except an outsider? I want to join!!

io Kukulcan · 05-30-2008, 06:13 PM

eeeagh! Iron bird!

Chip Midnight · 05-30-2008, 06:14 PM

I guess I'm in the minority here. I think people tend to react to things like this in a way that's arrogant and condescending, like "oh, aren't they precious! We shouldn't burden their primitive minds with knowledge of what the rest of the world is like." I think that's wrong headed. I would see nothing wrong with anthropologists making contact, learning their language, and giving them knowledge. Yeah, it's pretty cool that cultures like this have survived for so long, but they aren't children.

Put the shoe on the other foot. What if there are highly advanced aliens that know about life on Earth and have technology that could solve many of our problems, cure many of our diseases, and give us a thousand times more options for our future. I'd sure as hell want them to make contact, so long as it wasn't to exploit us or eat us for dinner.

**Beebo Brink** · 05-30-2008, 06:16 PM

Pretty much every indigenous tribe that has interacted with "civilization" has ended up in far worse shape than they were pre-contact.

Contact usually is the fore-runner of resource exploitation as their lands are despoiled by developers. They end up with a range of maladies running from STDs to alcoholism, a decimation of their culture, language and traditions, and an assimilation that usually ends up in the poorest ghettos of urban areas.

Leave them alone. They'll survive just fine without us.

Stormy Dyrssen · 05-30-2008, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chip Midnight

I guess I'm in the minority here. I think people tend to react to things like this in a way that's arrogant and condescending, like "oh, aren't they precious! We shouldn't burden their primitive minds with knowledge of what the rest of the world is like." I think that's wrong headed. I would see nothing wrong with anthropologists making contact, learning their language, and giving them knowledge. Yeah, it's pretty cool that cultures like this have survived for so long, but they aren't children.

Put the shoe on the other foot. What if there are highly advanced aliens that know about life on Earth and have technology that could solve many of our problems, cure many of our diseases, and give us a thousand times more options for our future. I'd sure as hell want them to make contact, so long as it wasn't to exploit us or eat us for dinner.

Who distributed disease to Native Americans?
I see what your saying, but if they have lived like this for how long? Then I think we would do more harm then good, even if intentions are good. IMO of course....

Quantum Destiny · 05-30-2008, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chip Midnight

I guess I'm in the minority here. I think people tend to react to things like this in a way that's arrogant and condescending, like "oh, aren't they precious! We shouldn't burden their primitive minds with knowledge of what the rest of the world is like." I think that's wrong headed. I would see nothing wrong with anthropologists making contact, learning their language, and giving them knowledge. Yeah, it's pretty cool that cultures like this have survived for so long, but they aren't children.

Put the shoe on the other foot. What if there are highly advanced aliens that know about life on Earth and have technology that could solve many of our problems, cure many of our diseases, and give us a thousand times more options for our future. I'd sure as hell want them to make contact, so long as it wasn't to exploit us or eat us for dinner.

Isn't it arrogant to believe that they need 'guidance' from us?

Chip Midnight · 05-30-2008, 06:24 PM

I'll never see knowledge as evil.

Quantum Destiny · 05-30-2008, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chip Midnight

I'll never see knowledge as evil.

Nor will I.

Walker · 05-30-2008, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atia

I feel it bit presumptuous to assume what our highly-developed civilization has to offer would make another culture happy or happier than they currently are. I've seen a few documentaries and read a book or two suggesting that isolation of this type is not a recipe for extinction or unhappiness. In fact, quite the contrary.

I don't mean to be presumptuous. I just find it interesting that we're OK with Brazil turning a blind eye to these people despite apparently knowing nothing about their customs and culture when those things can have pretty disturbing consequences in isolated communities and tribes.

When we regularly condemn conditions in third-world countries due to everything from poor education and poverty to female circumcisions and medieval style justice, how can we justify covering our eyes and ears to the plight of other groups of people and hoping for the best?

Now I'm not saying that these people are doing hideous things or even have a plight. Just that their welfare might not be so good (their infant mortality rate and average lifespan certainly won't be!), and wondering if we have a responsibility to assist them if that's the case. I'm certainly not suggesting we should attempt to change their culture or uproot them, but would contact really be so bad?

By the way, it occurred to me after writing my previous post that it looked a bit aimed at you, but that's not the case at all. I initially started responding to Tenshi, but your post just seemed to fit my questions better.

Brenda Connolly · 05-30-2008, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quantum Destiny

Well, yeah. Obviously the healthcare. I mean, the healthcare goes without saying, doesn't it? But apart from the plumbing,
the chocolate, the wi-fi and the healthcare, what has modern civilization done for us?

I can do without the wi fi, I'll take extra chocolate.

**Bard Jameson** · 05-30-2008, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chip Midnight

Put the shoe on the other foot. What if there are highly advanced aliens that know about life on Earth and have technology that could solve many of our problems, cure many of our diseases, and give us a thousand times more options for our future. I'd sure as hell want them to make contact, so long as it wasn't to exploit us or eat us for dinner.

(Bolded for proper emphasis)

Know of any examples from earth that don't fit that pattern? I'm not being rhetorical.

io Kukulcan · 05-30-2008, 06:44 PM

penicillin comes in handy, as do vaccinations, i'm gonna go way out on a limb here and say, polio sucks.

Quantum Destiny · 05-30-2008, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by io Kukulcan

penicillin comes in handy, as do vaccinations, i'm gonna go way out on a limb here and say, polio sucks.

Very true - they'll probably need all that if we 'introduce ourselves'.

05-30-2008, 06:16 PM	#41 (permalink)
Beebo Brink Uppity Alt SLU Supporter I'm the woman your mother warned you about. Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 4,875 My Mood: SLShopper Ads: 19 SL Join Date: October 2006 Business: Brazen Women Shapes and Skins	Pretty much every indigenous tribe that has interacted with "civilization" has ended up in far worse shape than they were pre-contact. Contact usually is the fore-runner of resource exploitation as their lands are despoiled by developers. They end up with a range of maladies running from STDs to alcoholism, a decimation of their culture, language and traditions, and an assimilation that usually ends up in the poorest ghettos of urban areas. Leave them alone. They'll survive just fine without us. __________________ Browse http://www.BrazenWomen.com

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05-30-2008, 05:36 PM	#34 (permalink)
Trout Recreant Oncorhynchus mykiss Incomprehensible gibberish Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: West Coast, USA Posts: 5,998 My Mood: Blog Entries: 3 Awards: 1	Liquor. I can't believe these people have made it so long without good bourbon. And porn. Definitely need to get them up to date on porn. We could teach them to gamble as well. Other than that, there isn't much they need. Maybe some ice for the bourbon - it's hot in the jungle.

05-30-2008, 06:02 PM	#36 (permalink)
Tussilago Senior Member Near defunct Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Sweden Posts: 107 My Mood:	You all sound like aliens discussing humanity.

05-30-2008, 06:13 PM	#39 (permalink)
io Kukulcan Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: the wasatch front Posts: 2,069 My Mood: SL Join Date: 04/2006	eeeagh! Iron bird!

05-30-2008, 06:14 PM	#40 (permalink)
Chip Midnight That template guy Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 3,561 My Mood: Business: CMFF XBOX Leaderboard: 9^th	I guess I'm in the minority here. I think people tend to react to things like this in a way that's arrogant and condescending, like "oh, aren't they precious! We shouldn't burden their primitive minds with knowledge of what the rest of the world is like." I think that's wrong headed. I would see nothing wrong with anthropologists making contact, learning their language, and giving them knowledge. Yeah, it's pretty cool that cultures like this have survived for so long, but they aren't children. Put the shoe on the other foot. What if there are highly advanced aliens that know about life on Earth and have technology that could solve many of our problems, cure many of our diseases, and give us a thousand times more options for our future. I'd sure as hell want them to make contact, so long as it wasn't to exploit us or eat us for dinner.

05-30-2008, 06:24 PM	#44 (permalink)
Chip Midnight That template guy Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 3,561 My Mood: Business: CMFF XBOX Leaderboard: 9^th	I'll never see knowledge as evil.

05-30-2008, 06:44 PM	#49 (permalink)
io Kukulcan Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: the wasatch front Posts: 2,069 My Mood: SL Join Date: 04/2006	penicillin comes in handy, as do vaccinations, i'm gonna go way out on a limb here and say, polio sucks.

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