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Old 09-05-2009, 12:37 PM   #26 (permalink)
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In addition to sabotaging our chillin's them nasty ol Democrats are trying to sabotage our next president.

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Old 09-05-2009, 12:57 PM   #27 (permalink)
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My sister called me last night to tell me that my youngest brother has embraced this stance. I'm not surprised as his father and uncle have always been racist, misogynist, far right-wing nut jobs. The sad thing is that he has a beautiful, bright 8-year old daughter.

As a country we don't need an external threat - we're so deeply divided that I sometimes wonder why we haven't had a civil war. Especially when people like my brother are excited about the idea of starting a revolution (and armed).

Stepping back and trying to analyze why a relatively intelligent, middle-class, 35-year old man would be so rabid. This may sound superficial, but based on what I saw growing up and what I hear from him and his compatriots, it's as simple as these guys feel like they've had their rightful and deserved wealth and social status stolen from them by women and minorities.

They don't see the differences between the economic environment in which their grandparents rose to affluence and the one they have to deal with. They're not willing to scrabble or deal with deprivation in pursuit of goals (like higher education).

All they see is these people who they think are their inferiors have it better than they do.

And don't forget - they're God's chosen people, so they should be reaping the wealth - not those infidels and heathens.
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Old 09-05-2009, 01:12 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Stepping back and trying to analyze why a relatively intelligent, middle-class, 35-year old man would be so rabid. This may sound superficial, but based on what I saw growing up and what I hear from him and his compatriots, it's as simple as these guys feel like they've had their rightful and deserved wealth and social status stolen from them by women and minorities.

They don't see the differences between the economic environment in which their grandparents rose to affluence and the one they have to deal with. They're not willing to scrabble or deal with deprivation in pursuit of goals (like higher education).
I've seen some of that, too. The irony is that women and minorities haven't changed those people's fortunes one bit - with or without civil rights, a stupid hick will always be a stupid hick. (Excuse the epithets, but most of the men I know who feel this way are just that - stupid backwater provincial hicks).

Furthermore, their parents and grandparents never came by their worldly goods through anything other than years of hard work. Most of the men around here embrace that work ethic, but there are a few who think they are entitled to the glory with none of the sweat, and those are the ones I'm calling stupid.

There's this faux philosophy which thinks that there's only so much pie to go around and if women or minorities get some of it there's less for the men. That's not how it works - actually, the more pie-makers we have, the more pie there is for everyone.
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Old 09-05-2009, 01:15 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Surreal, THIS is also a reason that I feel the liberal people should embrace gun ownership.

Their own protection. It's sick and sad, but the local militia here is itching for a revolution so they can control things again. The noise is getting louder.

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The Sons of Confederate Veterans are an extension of the first Confederate veterans group, the United Confederate Veterans, formed in 1889 New Orleans out of a movement trying to preserve important Confederate battle sites. It was reworked into the SCV in Richmond, VA, in 1896 with a more defined purpose of preserving the Confederate memory of the war. On the back of Block's SCV business card is a charge delivered by General Stephen D. Lee (the nephew of General Robert E. Lee) to the group in 1906, which has since become one of the group's organizing principles:

"To you, Sons of Confederate Veterans, we will submit the vindication of the cause for which we fought. To your strength will be given the defense of the Confederate soldier's good name, the guardianship of his history, the emulation of his virtues, and the perpetuation of those principles he loved. Remember, it is your duty to see that the true history of the South is presented to future generations."
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There is no mention of slavery on the group's "What Is The SCV?" page, and it's no stretch of the imagination to infer that the view of the Civil War (the "War of Northern Aggression," as it's occasionally referred to during the service) as a slavery-driven conflict is one such perceived distortion. At the service Block makes no bones about his contention that the institution was wrong, but he also states his belief that the vast majority of people who fought for the Confederacy did so over the political and economic issues of the time as opposed to the moral issue that later came to define it.
"The soldiers who died that day were defending their rights and their freedoms. They were defending their right to say, 'No, I don't agree with that.' They didn't have a lot of the freedoms at that time that we have; at that time you couldn't disagree with the government," he says.


Cont.
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Old 09-05-2009, 01:16 PM   #30 (permalink)
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I feel that there is going to be another civil war. I don't think that the Union really "won". I think the Confederates advanced to the rear, and are in waiting. And it is one of the thing that frightens me.

According to this 2008 report, people identifying themselves as Democrats are 37% and Republicans are 28% with 35% of people identified as Independents. Including people who said they were 'leaning' toward one party or the other, the breakdown is 51% Democrats, 38% Republicans, and 11% Independents in 2008.

I don't think it is about Democrats or Republicans. I think it is just a new way to say "Union or Confederate". Replace the Union blue, with the Democrat Blue... and the Confederate Gray with the GOP Red. You will also find the ideology quite similar as well as the red state vs blue state breakdown is similar as well.

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/2008/statemapredbluer512.png


(a cartogram, a map in which the sizes of states are rescaled according to their population.)

and a Confederate Map



This isn't about different ideologies based on a Union. We are back to Confederate vs Union.
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Old 09-05-2009, 01:20 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Surreal, THIS is also a reason that I feel the liberal people should embrace gun ownership.

Their own protection. It's sick and sad, but the local militia here is itching for a revolution so they can control things again. The noise is getting louder.
While I do own a gun and know how to use it, when it comes to the local militia I think most of them turn out to be undercover FBI or ATF agents don't they?

The FBI owns bigger guns than I do. They're also more dedicated and professional than your average radical loony.

That's the way it should be.
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Old 09-05-2009, 01:24 PM   #32 (permalink)
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I, for one, am glad to see some people are protecting this nation's children from something so dangerous as listening to the president of the country for an hour. Think of all that indoctrination!
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Old 09-05-2009, 01:26 PM   #33 (permalink)
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While I do own a gun and know how to use it, when it comes to the local militia I think most of them turn out to be undercover FBI or ATF agents don't they?

The FBI owns bigger guns than I do. They're also more dedicated and professional than your average radical loony.

That's the way it should be.

I don't mean protection from the Government. I mean from other people..

And I can only hope that most of them are undercover ATF or FBI. Please let that be.
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Old 09-05-2009, 01:34 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Surreal, THIS is also a reason that I feel the liberal people should embrace gun ownership.
You're preaching to the choir. I'm a proponent of responsible gun ownership. I've been thinking lately I should go back out to the range and polish my skills... I'm really out of practice.
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Old 09-05-2009, 01:40 PM   #35 (permalink)
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guns aren't bad for children, the president is.
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Old 09-05-2009, 01:43 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Old 09-05-2009, 01:56 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Surreal, THIS is also a reason that I feel the liberal people should embrace gun ownership.
And an eye for an eye still leaves everyone blind. In such an event that there is an armed insurrection in the US which the commander in chief of the largest military in the world is incapable of putting down, an airplane is truly your best defense. This is a reason that I feel the liberal people should embrace small aircraft ownership.

Lincoln had it really tough as his army was roughly equally armed to the secessionists. The disparity today between the armed forces and an unregulated militia is the proverbial elephant vs mouse.

It is important to remember that civil insurrection is lousy for established businesses which will demand action of the armies should no other motivation obtain. It is my belief that Waco, Ruby Ridge, YFZ Ranch and Philadelphia's MOVE massacre are the expected response of a government that feels threatened; I don't think they are exceptional cases and the government always wins through mean fair or foul.
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Old 09-05-2009, 02:11 PM   #38 (permalink)
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And an eye for an eye still leaves everyone blind. In such an event that there is an armed insurrection in the US which the commander in chief of the largest military in the world is incapable of putting down, an airplane is truly your best defense. This is a reason that I feel the liberal people should embrace small aircraft ownership.

Lincoln had it really tough as his army was roughly equally armed to the secessionists. The disparity today between the armed forces and an unregulated militia is the proverbial elephant vs mouse.

It is important to remember that civil insurrection is lousy for established businesses which will demand action of the armies should no other motivation obtain. It is my belief that Waco, Ruby Ridge, YFZ Ranch and Philadelphia's MOVE massacre are the expected response of a government that feels threatened; I don't think they are exceptional cases and the government always wins through mean fair or foul.
Agreed. And I don't see anyone advocating taking on either the government or a militia. If we had an armed insurrection, the last thing I plan to do is be in between the groups involved.

In case of civil unrest, it's not the principals that I'd be concerned about but rather the scavengers and opportunists that take advantage of chaos.
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Old 09-05-2009, 02:17 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Agreed. And I don't see anyone advocating taking on either the government or a militia. If we had an armed insurrection, the last thing I plan to do is be in between the groups involved.

In case of civil unrest, it's not the principals that I'd be concerned about but rather the scavengers and opportunists that take advantage of chaos.

QFFT

Exactly.

Looters do not care if you have children and looters do not care if you are a peace loving beatnik. Looters do not care if you offer to share your food stores. Why take half or even 1/4 if you can take it all?
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Old 09-05-2009, 02:20 PM   #40 (permalink)
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In case of civil unrest, it's not the principals that I'd be concerned about but rather the scavengers and opportunists that take advantage of chaos.
Same here. The Army and National Guard might be fighting open battles and chasing down insurrectionist militias, but in that chaos, there's lots of leeway for small gangs or individuals to do a lot of damage with little fear of law enforcement response.
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Old 09-05-2009, 03:17 PM   #41 (permalink)
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And I don't suffer from bravado or stupidity. If where I live goes to hell, I'm going to be hunkered down playing least in site as much as possible. The yahoos you see posturing with guns are idiots IMO.
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Old 09-05-2009, 03:33 PM   #42 (permalink)
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This is what the revolution is going to look like:

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Old 09-05-2009, 04:38 PM   #43 (permalink)
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Model 870™ Express® Compact Shotguns

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I currently pack a 9mm auto. But I'm thinking something like this may come in handy:

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Old 09-05-2009, 06:53 PM   #44 (permalink)
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Model 870™ Express® Compact Shotguns

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Pink camo? Is the Sanrio store that big a threat?
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Old 09-06-2009, 07:46 AM   #45 (permalink)
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While it is completely unrealistic - the "wingnut" rationale is along the lines that the Obama Administration is turning into a Cult of Personality.

Just like any charismatic fascist or Socialist leader.

It is excessively ironic that the same people in many cases who want God in public school don't want the President in them.

Concern over Obama becoming that sort of Iconic figure is understandable of course, but it seems more like they finding Ghosts because they want to see Ghosts.

Pretty much like those people who thought Bush was going to not step down at the end of his administration. They would constantly come up with things that they felt portended of a Bush dictatorial takeover.
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Old 09-06-2009, 08:27 AM   #46 (permalink)
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And I don't suffer from bravado or stupidity. If where I live goes to hell, I'm going to be hunkered down playing least in site as much as possible. The yahoos you see posturing with guns are idiots IMO.
And not a damn person will know it's here. Posturing is for people who think they can take on anyone. No one in this house is that stupid.

Home protection is not used unless your life is in danger. And if people know about it, why not just take that from you, too? Don't use or point a gun unless you are ready to pull the trigger and end another person's existence. That's not for fun or games.
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Old 09-06-2009, 10:30 AM   #47 (permalink)
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well, Kwik Shot - Online Skeet Shooting Game I mean skeet shooting is fun. But those clay pigeons are just asking for it...
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Old 09-06-2009, 11:07 AM   #48 (permalink)
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While it is completely unrealistic - the "wingnut" rationale is along the lines that the Obama Administration is turning into a Cult of Personality.

Just like any charismatic fascist or Socialist leader.
The irony is that so many of them believe this solely because Glenn Beck / Sarah Palin / Rush Limbaugh told them so.

But where exactly is that personality cult? Every time I look across the ocean, I see liberals bickering about how Obama's selling out the health care reform just as much if not more than the righties. And this is nothing new, there has always been a high degree of doubt about Obama on the left as far as I can tell.

I've chatted with right-wingers who literally believed that Bush was sent by God - where's the left-wing equivalent?

It's not as if I'm saying that this can't happen - for example, in Germany, we have a left-wing party that is almost solely run by the ego of a single man (Oskar Lafontaine) - but when I look at the USA, I see nothing of that kind. Alright, there's the typical pop star aura that comes with holding the President's office, but that's all.

Do all these people even realize how ridiculous those "personality cult" claims look from countries that have been through all this shit?

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Old 09-07-2009, 06:37 PM   #49 (permalink)
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you can actually sense the evil in the man as you read through this... it's as well some parents stopped their children hearing it... disgusting..
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Old 09-07-2009, 06:44 PM   #50 (permalink)
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Media Resources Prepared School Remarks

you can actually sense the evil in the man as you read through this... it's as well some parents stopped their children hearing it... disgusting..
OMG!!! Thats some inflammatory stuff he's preaching! All the kids need is 2 minutes of this, and they will be goose-stepping, Socialist Nazi Communists! He must be stopped!
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