Psyke Phaeton

Researchers: Asteroid Destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah : Slice of SciFi

"A clay tablet that has baffled scientists for 150 years has been identified as a witness’s account of the asteroid suspected of being behind the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah.

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Debris consisting of up to two-thirds of the asteroid would have been hurled back along its route and a flash reaching temperatures of 400 Centigrade (752 Fahrenheit) would have been created, killing anyone in its path.

About one million sq kilometers (386,000 sq miles) would have been devastated and the impact would have been equivalent to more than 1,000 tons of TNT exploding."

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Joshua Nightshade

Shouldn't scientists determine if they actually existed before they theorize what destroyed them? o_0

Psyke Phaeton

The destruction was such that the cities were destroyed and abandoned. I have just watched a History Channel documentary on it. Of the 4 (?) cities mentioned in the bible 1 was spared and it was found on a 6 BC tiled floor map. That was then used as a reference to locate the others. Structures and mass graves (20,000) were found. But no way to know what those places were called.

It all ties together quite well.

Vengence Opus

They were sodomized by an assteroid?

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“If you're losing your soul and you know it, then you've still got a soul left to lose.” ~ Charles Bukowski

Lucifer Baphomet

Five cities, lay on the plain of the Jordan according to the bible... Sodom, Gomorrah, Admah, Zeboim, and Bela , only Bela was spared destruction according to the legend.

The Roman historian Strabo, said there once 13 cities there, Sodom being the most important

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Khamudy

The cities most likely existed within the plains around modern day Masada, although it can be very difficult to match modern and received place names with their ancient counterparts and then tie them together with evidence on the ground.

The problem with that whole area is that it was always very marginal, being prone to droughts and famines that sent people into Egypt and Mesopotamia and at the same time the whole area, from Jordan up to the shores of Turkey was a patchwork pattern of endlessly bickering and fighting petty city states. These were also frequently the targets for military raiding by neighbouring empires like the Egyptians, Babylonians, Assyrians, Mitanni and Hittites.

The problem is that there are many settled sites in that region that were destroyed during this warfare - which often took on an element of ethnic cleansing - and as a result there are numerous sites that have evidence of utter destruction by fire and then were never reoccupied. There is also still a significant number of archaeologists who look to the study of the cultures of Mesopotamia, the Levant and Egypt in order to prove the factual basis of the Bible, which leads them to read into the evidence usually more than what is there.

I tend to be sceptical of such claims and in this case, I don't think an Assyrian reworking of a Sumerian astrological observation is sufficient proof of anything and I think the theory that there was large-scale fallout from an asteroid impact would need to be corroborated by evidence from other settlements within the "fall out" zone.

I won't say it is impossible to find Sodom, since the same was said about Troy, however caution has to be taken so that the same mistakes are not made (in that the discoverer of Troy got into such a zeal to find and prove the existence of "Troy of the Illiad" that he destroyed numerous layers of later settlement to find it. Now there is some consensus that the layer of the "Troy of the Illiad" was probably one of the upper layers he destroyed).

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Vivianne Draper

oh come on you know that's totally "theory" -- it was God that destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah - it says so in the Bible. You humanists are just going to rewrite history aren't you?

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Joshua Nightshade

As I understand it they haven't conclusively proven they were real, so some announcement that they know what did them in is a little weird to me.

(Admittedly I think the last time I "researched" this was high school, but a quick Wikipedia check doesn't jump out anything different.)

FlipperPA Peregrine

An asteroid...




THROWN BY GOD!

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Khamudy

I don't really have reason to doubt either Sodom or Gomorrah existed. They possibly went by different names and those we use are a later corruption, however, there is reasonable evidence to suggest that these two settlements were in the region of Magada - this area has evidence of numerous complex urban settlements with an inter-relationship between them, which is where Strabo's later comments on the region come in. Pinpointing a specific site may be more difficult and would probably require the recovery of written evidence from the site itself.

However, as to the destruction, evidence across that region indicates many of the settlements were burned, however, exactly what caused the burning is probably unknown. It would be easy to say "divine meteors", but the mass migrations of the Sea Peoples, Phoenicians, Peleset, etc. around 1200 BC caused widespread destruction and many cities from Greece round to Egypt were burned as these waves of people moved through.

The problem with the specific tablet mentioned is the date they've estimated the astronomical observation as being. 3123 BC is rather early for a text on astronomy, given that it is about the time that writing first began appearing. It's possible that the copy is of a record from that date, but it really does put it far, far back into the past and this date does not correlate well with the estimated destructions of the sites within the Magada region.

It is possible to take the view that the Sodom story recycled a dimly recalled event from early prehistory, in the same way that the floods of Noah may be a combination of a retelling of Mesopotamian creation myths and a flood that seems to have affected a wide area of ancient Sumeria at one time (the city of Ur, for example, had a layer of river/flood sediment 6 feet thick, with settlement layers above and below it).

As to the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah being because of anything divine or because of particular patterns of behaviour, I'd say that is just more of the overarching aim of the Old Testament - to reinforce and glorify the Kingdom of Israel and its successor states and to promote and reinforce the position of the cult of Jehovah over the other loca indigenous cults and those the Israelites came into contact with during the Babylonian captivity.

Colette Meiji

well to be rational about it, it would be the easiest way.

Since the bible said fire and brimstone .. asteroid is pretty much the same thing

If God were to exist .. out there in the heavens and stuff. Just nudge an asteroid at the right time.

Since It is all knowing and all that it probably has the math skills to get it right on the first try even.

Colette Meiji

Is that the one by the naked Archaeologist?

That was an excellent episode.


There definitely were cities where Sodom and Gammora* were supposed to be.




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(* however the fuck its spelled)

Joshua Nightshade

Oh I don't doubt they existed either, my point is just that I think it's a bit strange to declare the reason of their destruction proven when they haven't even found the cities in the first place; it's the implied validation of the first that seems a little to me. Because obviously if they've proven what got rid of them that implies they proved they were there to begin with, right? 0_o

Chip Midnight

The Naked Archeologist is an awful show. It's not a show about science. It's a show about apologetics. He routinely talks to "experts" who'll say things like "we're now standing less than 500 yards from where Jesus lived!" Uh, right. And you know that how exactly? It's an entertaining show but it's hardly objective.

Colette Meiji

That .. and how do they know the witness was really a eye-witness and not a "Witness" (in the evangelical sense)?

Its just a tablet that is a couple thousand years old.

Theres no proof of anything.

Colette Meiji

hmmm Chip .. I think you maybe approach the show with pre-conceived Bias.

The host never says things like "they are now standing less than 500 yards from where Jesus lived."

Some of the "experts" or "guests" may say things like that.

But the host is always careful to say "This might be." Or "If that is true .. then we would be standing less than 500 yards .."

There is a Considerable difference.

In fact he takes a decidedly non-canonical approach to what is in the bible. In that episode it seems pretty clear he doesn't think God destroyed Sodom and Gammora for instance.

Chip Midnight

That's the only kinds of "experts" he ever interviews. There are no skeptics to be found on that show, and his half-hearted maybes and ifs are just there to give a thin patina of credibility. The show is extremely biased towards offering reassurances to Abrahamic theists.

Circle Widdershins

sshh.. Stop talking and let Khamudy say more.

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Joshua Nightshade

I know, I read it in a British accent and touch myself.




Is that TMI? Stop judging me.

Colette Meiji

The show is based on accounts of the bible and historical and archaeological relevance.

Atheists don't study generally study the bible in depth. Even rarer are those who look for correlations between the bible and actual Historical places and events.

Most of the archaeological work done in the places discussed in the bible is done by theists. Indeed many of them are Isrealis.

Thus the experts are going to be theists.

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That said - not all the "experts" say things like "god did this, god did that." Some definitely do. But they aren't the host of the show.

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The show really doesn't have any evangelical slant. The Host is obviously Jewish. And he doesn't really seem to be out to convert anyone.

I have yet to see an episode where they held anything up as "God did this"

Instead they focus on "This is a lot what is like happens in the text"

Chip Midnight

My problem with the show is that it never offers alternative explanations or presents any contrary evidence. All evidence is offered as evidence in support of the Bible and you'll never see commentary critical of the leaps being made which aren't backed up by anything. My favorite episode is when they take a look at a bowl shaped impression in a cave and leap all the way to it being a baptismal pool used by John the Baptist or something like that. No explanation was offered to how that massive leap was justified of course. It was laugh out loud funny (in a thoroughly irritating disservice to the viewing audience kind of way).

Colette Meiji

Also Chip - I think you have your shows mixed up.

The Naked Archaeologist does mostly Old Testament stuff. He is Jewish.

It is the Digging for the truth Guy who does the Jesus stories.

Chip Midnight

He does both old and new. Didn't you see the crucifixion episode where he gets hung up on a cross to find out just how uncomfortable it is?

Colette Meiji

Well the alternative explanation is that they are wrong.

It is all in the realm of speculation.

The whole show is conjecture and its very clear that it is. Archeology *IS* conjecture. The entire science is like that. If you take a course in it the whole class is "This might have been used for this, That may have been for that."

Sometimes they get better correlations. Often they do not.

That is where Archeology diverges from History.

Now people who believe that its not conjecture.. Thats another issue. Like this story that led to this thread.

Colette Meiji

I didn't, no. I don't see it much anymore now that I am working. But I did see the Sodom and Gammora twice.

But actual Jesus or no. Crucification was not fiction ..