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Edav Nomad · 10-24-2008, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sooz Pascale

Running in 2012? I don't know. If Obama wins and is doing a good job, the Republicans, given the shambles that party is in currently wil probably have to nominate a sacrificial lamb. I think 2016 would be more like it.

Sooz

I was thinking 2016 as well since she'll only be 52 years old. I think before then she'll stay as Governor for the rest of her term and then she'll run for the U.S. Senate.

P.S. I'm surprised nobody has said Porn Star yet.

FlipperPA Peregrine · 10-24-2008, 04:52 PM

In 2016, Palin will be as much of an afterthought as Ferraro is today... possibly less, since she's not the first female veep candidate.

Cindy Claveau · 10-24-2008, 05:31 PM

Palin in 2012? No Way - The Stump

My favorite points:

Quote:

2.) Jon concedes that “some conservative commentators have attacked her,” but adds that “these are a small minority and almost all of them work for publications aimed at mainstream readers, not the conservative subculture.” I’m not sure this is right. Yes, David Brooks works for a mainstream outlet. But Kathleen Parker lacerated Palin in National Review, while Peggy Noonan did the same in the Wall Street Journal opinion pages. If there’s a better way to influence conservative opinion (at least in print), I’m not aware of it.

Anyway, I'm not so sure that the distinction between mainstream and conservative publications matters much these days. Former Bush speechwriter and conservative-in-good-standing David Frum laid into Palin in the National Post--not exactly the house organ of the conservative movement. But I doubt it passed into the ether without right-wing blog-readers hearing about it first. (Likewise, I'd guess Kristol's pronouncements in the Times get as much play on conservative blogs as his pronouncements in The Weekly Standard.)

More importantly, while I agree that Palin's critics are a minority on the right, that can hardly be reassuring to her. Partisans are loath to criticize their own in the closing weeks of a campaign. Surely numerous conservative Palin skeptics are keeping quiet till after the election, when there's no risk of hurting their party. Which is to say, we’re clearly looking at the floor for Palin criticism, not the ceiling. It’ll get much worse from here on out.

Quote:

4.) There will be plenty of other candidates to fill Palin’s niche in 2012--except much, much more competently. Mike Huckabee, for one, has demonstrated both an appeal to populist-minded social conservatives and an ability to speak coherently without notes or a teleprompter. Bobby Jindal has done the same. I have a hard time seeing Palin as much of a match-up for either of them.

5.) As I’ve argued before, Palin doesn’t wear well over any extended length of time—the reason being that her chief asset is novelty, which fades by definition. I’d venture that one reason she remains so popular among working-class conservatives is that they follow politics less closely than the rest of us, meaning they’ve had less time to get burnt out on her. (Though I’d concede that her appeal to this group is based on more than novelty alone.) Unfortunately, a presidential primary is one of the most drawn-out, grueling selection processes ever devised. If Palin didn’t wear well in a two-month campaign, I have a hard time believing she’ll wear well over an 18-month primary season.

**Eboni Khan** · 10-24-2008, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlipperPA Peregrine

In 2016, Palin will be as much of an afterthought as Ferraro is today... possibly less, since she's not the first female veep candidate.

It depends on if Palin become bitter and has all the legal issues that Ferraro did at the time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geraldine_Ferraro

Quote:

Ferraro had relinquished her House seat to run for the vice-presidency. Her fame led to her appearing in a Diet Pepsi commercial in 1985.[4][55] She published Ferraro: My Story, an account of the campaign with some of her life leading up to it, in November 1985. It was a best seller and earned her $1 million.[56] She also joined a law firm.[55] Despite the one-sided national loss, Ferraro was still viewed as someone with a bright political future. Many expected her to run in the 1986 United States Senate election in New York against first-term Republican incumbent Al D'Amato.[56] Indeed, this had been her original plan for her career, before she was named to Mondale's ticket. But in December 1985, she said she would not run, due to the overhanging cloud from an ongoing U.S. Justice Department probe on her and her husband's finances stemming from the 1984 campaign revelations.[56]
Members of Ferraro's family were indeed facing legal issues. In January 1985, her husband John Zaccaro had pleaded guilty to fraudulently obtain bank financing in a real estate transaction and had been sentenced to 150 hours of community service.[57] Then in October 1986, he was indicted on unrelated felony charges regarding an alleged 1981 bribery of Queens Borough President Donald Manes concerning a cable television contract.[58] A full year later, he was acquitted at trial.[59] Meanwhile, in February 1986, the couple's son John had been arrested for possession and sale of cocaine.[60] He was convicted, and in June 1988 sentenced to four months imprisonment, as Ferraro broke down in tears in court relating the stress the episode had placed on her family.[60]
By October 1991, Ferraro was ready to enter politics again, as she was running for the Democratic nomination in the 1992 United States Senate election in New York.[61] Her opponents were State Attorney General Robert Abrams, Rev. Al Sharpton, Congressman Robert J. Mrazek, and New York City Comptroller and former Congresswoman Elizabeth Holtzman. Abrams was considered the early front-runner.[61] The D'Amato campaign feared facing Ferraro the most among these, as her Italian ancestry, effective debating and stump speech skills, and her staunch pro-choice views would eat into several of D'Amato's usual bases of support.[62] Ferraro drew renewed attacks during the primary campaign from the media and her opponents over her husband's finances and business relationships.[63] She rebuffed the charges strongly, objecting that a male candidate would not receive nearly as much attention regarding his wife's activities.[63] Ferraro became the front-runner, capitalizing on her star power from 1984 and her use of the campaign attacks against her as an explicitly feminist rallying point for women voters.[63] As the primary date neared, her lead began to dwindle under the charges, and she released additional tax returns from the 1980s to try to defray the attacks;[64] the final debates were nasty, and Holtzman in particular was constantly attacking Ferraro's integrity and finances.[65][66] On the September 15, 1992 primary, Abrams edged out Ferraro by less than percentage point, winning 37 percent of the vote to 36 percent.[66] Abrams spent much of the remainder of the campaign trying to get Ferraro's endorsement. Ferraro, bitter after the nature of the primary, was eventually coerced by state party leaders into giving it with just three days to go before the general election, which D'Amato won by a very narrow margin.[65]

If Palin can keep her job as Governor, continue to do well, and possibly be elected again for Governor or US Senate, she can keep her spot light by continuing to strike while the iron is hot. Palin, is not Ferraro, just because Ferraro didn't continue to move forward in politics doesn't mean that Palin won't.

Also, geez way to kick Ferraro in the teeth, she is still a relevant figure she continued to have a decent career even if it wasn't what other people thought she would have.

Cindy Claveau · 10-24-2008, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cindy Claveau

Palin in 2012? No Way - The Stump

Wow. Some of the comments on that article really get to the point:

Quote:

Palin is presently a candidate whose popularity does not extend beyond the Repuclican right wing base. The energy in the next four years among the Republican camp is going to go into figuring out what the hell happened and how to rebuild. Frum and others have already begun the process. This is not just one lost election, this appears to be a real sea change. I doubt the new Republican party will be built on the same foundation of refighting the sixties culture war that worked for half a century but now smells so badly of defeat.

The reactionary far right has never been the source of real intellectual energy for building the Republican party. The party has used them, taken them for granted as the Dems have taken African Americans for granted, and eventually handed over power to them and watched them squander it. But the reactionary far right has never been the real fuel of the party when it came to ideas or governing. In their hubris, they came to believe that because they brought in money and got out the vote, they were the wellspring of American conservatism. They aren't and they never were. They were just money and votes energized by hatred, and the party used them because it got them power. But that trophy wife has aged and all the botox in the world -- not to mention lipstick -- isn't going to make the pig look pretty.

The Republican party will not be looking to Palin as the new Buckley, Goldwater, Reagan or Gingrich. If she is able to organize as Obama did (right!) and gain a large following in the GOP, then I would not be surprised to see a third party arise in reaction to that. The brains of the right are not going to sit idly by for years as she leads the party toward empty-headed fascism. Look what she's done for party unity in two months, then imagine smart people on the right looking to her for leadership for periods of years.

Palin's worse enemies are the intellectual right. Instead of defending Palin did as they did Reagan when he was attacked for being vacuous, they will be her most ferocious attackers. In this scenario Palin could truly be the end of the Republican party. I'll say it agian -- this is a sea change, the new conservative wine will not be put in the old bottle of the sixties culture war. That, I believe we can say now, is a battle that is over. It energized the right for a long time, but it's not working now and it will probably never work again. Screaming "Commie! Hippie! Ni**er!" no longer has the magic power it once had. Not with the new generation. The right must find new ideas and new enemies.

Well said, IMO.

reeneebob Birmingham · 10-24-2008, 06:25 PM

I'm a Sens fan, tride and true, and Scott is a Flyers fan. We were both watching that game and when Dean hit the ice face down and obviously completely limp like a ragdoll, I think we both wanted to puke.

And Downie laughed.

I am so glad he has been bounced back to the AHL this season. Preferably he should have skates on period. I rank him up there with Claude Lemieux...someone so dirty it's one of the only times I ever heard my father call someone a fucking dirty asshole.

The Bergeron thing was clean, but the league is OVER sensitive now.

FYI this is my favorite thing EVER...the 2004 3 period boxing match between Ottawa and Philly and occasionally there was hockey.

YouTube - Flyers/Senators Brawl Part I

YouTube - Flyers/Senators Brawl Part II

YouTube - Flyers/Senators Brawl Part III

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlipperPA Peregrine

That was unacceptable. I really don't like Downie, and I'm a Flyers fan. I like smart hockey players - Kimmo Timonen being a current favorite - and he just looks, plays, and sounds dumb.

That said, Randy Jones still gets grief for his "dirty hit" on Patrice Bergeron last year. I disagree - Randy Jones is a clean player, and that was just an unfortunate injury. There was no intent to injure on that play, and the fact it keeps getting brought up as dirty boils my blood.

Watch the difference.

BAD AND DIRTY:
YouTube - Steve Downie hit on Dean McAmmond

UNFORTUNATE, BUT CLEAN:
YouTube - Randy Jones hit on Patrice Bergeron

Regards,

-Flip

10-24-2008, 04:52 PM	#77 (permalink)
FlipperPA Peregrine Evil Incarnate! Recursion is beautiful! Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Philadelphia, PA Posts: 6,378 My Mood: SLShopper Ads: 1 SL Join Date: 2003-11-14 Business: Peregrine Salon	In 2016, Palin will be as much of an afterthought as Ferraro is today... possibly less, since she's not the first female veep candidate. __________________ Peregrine Salon: Flip & Jenn's thang.

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