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Old 04-15-2018, 06:18 PM   #1 (permalink)
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"I was a teacher for 17 years, but I couldn't read or write"

It's a really good story. It got me thinking about how often I've worked with "lazy" people who obviously lacked an essential job skill, but could be very diligent, likable, and personable and just seemed to skate by anyway.

I see this a lot with people in programming related jobs. A lot of people in such jobs can't actually write original logic. They have to google and ask for "help" all the time. But some of them seem to even thrive with favorable opinions from management.

‚€˜I was a teacher for 17 years, but I couldn‚€™t read or write‚€™ - BBC News

EDIT: I mean redundant questions to coworkers, not when first learning.

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Old 04-16-2018, 07:36 AM   #2 (permalink)
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There's nothing wrong with coders who google for examples or explanations. Some of the smartest people I know do this, not to have things 'easy' but to not reinvent the wheel when there's no point in doing so.

A lot of people learn new technology from help forums and reading other people's issues as well. That also isn't necessarily a sign of skating by, but of actively seeking new skills and keeping up to date on the latest technology. I've been both an asker and answerer of questions posed by those who need help with syntax or new languages and really think its a mistake to think that anyone, no matter their skillset and job, looking for help is lacking required skills. Sometimes, especially in coding, the ability to find the resources to learn how to do something quickly and elegantly is the most essential skill of all.
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Old 04-16-2018, 07:48 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Honestly, the "better" I get at coding things, the more it seems like 90% of coding is finding existing code and mashing it together so it works.

I am not sure thats exactly what you are saying though. It seems like you mean more the basic concept.

"How do I add two numbers?" Being the extreme end simple of what you are talking about, as opposed to "Which code do Inuse to make a plus sign".

Granted adding is extrmely simple, but its a difference of what do I do vs how do I do it. One shows someone clueless to the logic, One shows the person knows the logic, they are just unfamiliar with the code.
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Old 04-16-2018, 04:21 PM   #4 (permalink)
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That is how you learn anything - mash bits and pieces till they work and maybe one day you will get them and create your own code or book or fabulous physics equation.

That dude is pretty extraordinary and probably had dyslexia but not necessarily as my gran had pretty same experience bar teaching or going to uni. I am going to bet plenty share it but not many would admit nor be teachers.

We all learn differently and some things others do well will be awful for us and vice versa. I still cannot mash words together well, reading went pretty much same for me - brain identified letters and noises but blanked when connecting to meaning. However, writing was demanded at same time alongside with a abusive pre-school teacher who demanded uh ... primary school stuff with literal piles of homework. It resulted in me replicating hundreds of notebooks because written shitely (still guilty); it did not stick until teenage years. Dude is quite right on that side along with poems oddly, especially with emo and abstract ones where you have to chose words really carefully and structure them in various ways to get desired effect. Best poets were not very good at the whole gig themselves and my favourite poem is creative ways of author writing "I have an oven in my lounge".

There used to be a grand website which illustrated the whole code mashing thing based on CSS. The idea was for people to show elements of their site such as footer or menu and showcase the code which is what most tutorials do but liked the concept of site as it called itself a cookbook and encouraged to pick and chose. Unfortunately, does not exist any longer but similar ones probably do. Language would be precisely the same - mix all till it works and something might come out of it even if you don't get it. Music composers done same since forever ... or all those players who never heard a thing.
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Old 04-16-2018, 10:17 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I'm lucky, I've dyslexia, but its fairly minor and I've always read well.

It more feels like, instead of anyone being bothered to -teach- [and my mom is the same generation - she reads fine, but do not ever ask her to spell anything at all - she can't], they just sort of foisted him off on someone else.
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Old 04-17-2018, 02:39 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramen Jedburgh View Post
Granted adding is extremely simple,
..Until the sum of your two signed integers exceeds the maximum positive value of that particular type of integer, and the result goes negative (and vice-versa).

..Until the sum of your two unsigned integers exceeds the maximum possible value of that particular type of integer, and the result is truncated to an incorrect value.

..Until you add two floating-point numbers and the result is incorrect because a fixed number of binary bits cannot precisely hold all possible exact values of the result.

..Until you add an integer and a floating-point number with an integer result, and are faced with unpredictable rounding (in some systems).

Adding is simple in the real world - in computers ? not so much...
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Old 04-17-2018, 08:45 AM   #7 (permalink)
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65535 + 1 = (^_^)
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Old 04-17-2018, 11:18 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramen Jedburgh View Post
Honestly, the "better" I get at coding things, the more it seems like 90% of coding is finding existing code and mashing it together so it works.

I am not sure thats exactly what you are saying though. It seems like you mean more the basic concept.

"How do I add two numbers?" Being the extreme end simple of what you are talking about, as opposed to "Which code do Inuse to make a plus sign".

Granted adding is extrmely simple, but its a difference of what do I do vs how do I do it. One shows someone clueless to the logic, One shows the person knows the logic, they are just unfamiliar with the code.
Yes, if someone has a really detailed question that probably crops up once in a blue moon they can get to the answer quicker by going to some site like expertsexchange than spending a month of chargeable time researching the problem. If they are asking something fundamental to their field (especially if asking it every week) they really should be sent to a class.
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Old 04-17-2018, 11:26 AM   #9 (permalink)
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65535 + 1 = (^_^)
Almost went to what earned you a sig.
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Old 04-17-2018, 01:48 PM   #10 (permalink)
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65535 + 1 = (^_^)
On the system I cut my teeth on, (Univac 418-III) that gave an answer of -0.
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Old 04-18-2018, 08:08 PM   #11 (permalink)
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There's nothing wrong with coders who google for examples or explanations. Some of the smartest people I know do this, not to have things 'easy' but to not reinvent the wheel when there's no point in doing so.
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Originally Posted by Ramen Jedburgh View Post
I am not sure thats exactly what you are saying though. It seems like you mean more the basic concept.

"How do I add two numbers?" Being the extreme end simple of what you are talking about, as opposed to "Which code do Inuse to make a plus sign".
I don't mean googling is bad. What I meant are people who have to ask the person next to them or google lots of totally redundant questions since they never grasped the basic concept. Like:

"How do I add 3 months to a date in language X?"

"How do I add a year to a date in language X?"

"How do I subtract a month from a date in language X?"

"How do I go to the first day of the current month in language X?"

"How do I go to the first day of the next month in language X?"

None of these questions are bad in isolation, but when the same person has to ask all of them, over and over, you know they aren't grasping the underlying structure. Almost no coding questions are stupid when asked once, but when someone has to ask for "help" with everything they do, something's wrong.

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Old 04-19-2018, 07:41 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Old 04-19-2018, 09:15 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Old 04-19-2018, 11:38 PM   #14 (permalink)
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There's nothing wrong with coders who google for examples or explanations. Some of the smartest people I know do this, not to have things 'easy' but to not reinvent the wheel when there's no point in doing so.

A lot of people learn new technology from help forums and reading other people's issues as well. That also isn't necessarily a sign of skating by, but of actively seeking new skills and keeping up to date on the latest technology. I've been both an asker and answerer of questions posed by those who need help with syntax or new languages and really think its a mistake to think that anyone, no matter their skillset and job, looking for help is lacking required skills. Sometimes, especially in coding, the ability to find the resources to learn how to do something quickly and elegantly is the most essential skill of all.
Uh geeze yeah, I can either google the problem and make it go away in five minutes or I can bash my head into some nonsensical microsoft error code that has no actual information in it for a few years. As a hiring manager the words "I'm really good with a search engine" is legit a big positive. I've had my fill of know it alls who it turns out actually can't possibly know it all because there's about 10 million permutations of any particular problem depending what software is involved.
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Old 04-20-2018, 10:38 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Let's make this thread about me. =^-^=

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Old 04-20-2018, 10:52 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Let's make this thread about me. =^-^=

"I was a test engineer for !@ years, but I never had a diploma of any kind."
Immy has nice hair.
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Old 04-21-2018, 11:21 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Old 04-22-2018, 03:25 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Old 04-22-2018, 08:33 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Old 04-22-2018, 10:02 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
"How do I add 3 months to a date in language X?"

"How do I add a year to a date in language X?"

"How do I subtract a month from a date in language X?"

"How do I go to the first day of the current month in language X?"

"How do I go to the first day of the next month in language X?"
Date::Calc

The above along with many others such as

Easter_Sunday
($year,$month,$day) = Easter_Sunday($year);
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Old 04-23-2018, 08:07 AM   #21 (permalink)
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I always laugh when people whose religion it is can not remember when the traditional date for easter sunday is. What is so hard to remember about "the first sunday after the first full moon after the spring equinox"?
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Old 04-23-2018, 08:10 AM   #22 (permalink)
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I always laugh when people whose religion it is can not remember when the traditional date for easter sunday is. What is so hard to remember about "the first sunday after the first full moon after the spring equinox"?
You know, considering its a holiday centered around raising the dead, you would think that Christians would want to give it a date that doesn't sound like some witchcraft level set up.
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Old 04-23-2018, 10:00 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Its based on when Passover is, iirc.
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Old 04-23-2018, 12:16 PM   #24 (permalink)
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You know, considering its a holiday centered around raising the dead, you would think that Christians would want to give it a date that doesn't sound like some witchcraft level set up.
Shh! They might catch on!
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Old 04-23-2018, 03:03 PM   #25 (permalink)
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The following chart gives the offset from Easter of various holidays

Carnival Monday / Rosenmontag / Veille du Mardi Gras = -48 days
Mardi Gras / Karnevalsdienstag / Mardi Gras = -47 days
Ash Wednesday / Aschermittwoch / Mercredi des Cendres = -46 days
Palm Sunday / Palmsonntag / Dimanche des Rameaux = -7 days
Easter Friday / Karfreitag / Vendredi Saint = -2 days
Easter Saturday / Ostersamstag / Samedi de Paques = -1 day
Easter Monday / Ostermontag / Lundi de Paques = +1 day
Ascension of Christ / Christi Himmelfahrt / Ascension = +39 days
Whitsunday / Pfingstsonntag / Dimanche de Pentecote = +49 days
Whitmonday / Pfingstmontag / Lundi de Pentecote = +50 days
Feast of Corpus Christi / Fronleichnam / Fete-Dieu = +60 days
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