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Old 01-28-2018, 11:31 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Man Shot While "Hunting" Captive Lions

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Old 01-28-2018, 12:04 PM   #2 (permalink)
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What a shame. Sure hope it doesn't happen over and over and over.
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Old 01-28-2018, 12:28 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Mysterious Hero Defends Lions Against "Legal" Poachers
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Old 01-28-2018, 01:11 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Hunting captive lions? WTF is wrong with people???

Hunting wild animals for sport is bad enough. But hunting animals that can't get away from you - for sport? That's just lazy and despicable!
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Old 01-28-2018, 01:25 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Old 01-28-2018, 02:04 PM   #6 (permalink)
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I found a picture of that dead, craven hunter:



Clearly, someone mistook him for a lion.
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Old 01-28-2018, 02:13 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Pretty much abandoned any pretense of "hunting" by that point.
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Old 01-28-2018, 03:51 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I can't wait for when they start hunting in zoos.
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Old 01-28-2018, 04:25 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I'd read that as hunting lions which had been bred in captivity, then released into the wild to be hunted - a bit like breeding pheasants to be shot in the UK.
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Old 01-28-2018, 10:02 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I'd read that as hunting lions which had been bred in captivity, then released into the wild to be hunted - a bit like breeding pheasants to be shot in the UK.
I got the same impression from what was available in the articles. Not that my opinion changes much. I dislike the long-established British (and American-learned) tradition of breeding birds or other animals for the purpose of 'hunting' them. Lines of shooters advance as beaters behind them drive the animals ahead to be used for target practice. Quite sporting, no?

When it comes to any of our fellow predators I draw the line. Leave 'em alone, unless you suddenly find yourself nominated for a lion's happy meal. Also, a 75 year old man has no business going 'on safari' in the first place.
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Old 01-28-2018, 10:17 PM   #11 (permalink)
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I don't give a fuck if they were captive-bred to sing showtunes and ride unicycles. The guy got what he deserved.

There's also this, which happened at the same "ranch"

https://www.dailysun.co.za/News/Nati...njury-20170830
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Old 01-28-2018, 10:31 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Breeding animals in captivity just to be killed for sport seems to me to be even more fucked up than just plain killing animals for sport. Like, at least one layer more fucked up.
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Old 01-28-2018, 10:57 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Dillon Levenque View Post
I got the same impression from what was available in the articles. Not that my opinion changes much. I dislike the long-established British (and American-learned) tradition of breeding birds or other animals for the purpose of 'hunting' them. Lines of shooters advance as beaters behind them drive the animals ahead to be used for target practice. Quite sporting, no?

When it comes to any of our fellow predators I draw the line. Leave 'em alone, unless you suddenly find yourself nominated for a lion's happy meal. Also, a 75 year old man has no business going 'on safari' in the first place.
I think with grouse, the speed at which they fly when the beaters disturb them means you're not really "using them for target practice" unless you are a really very good shot. It's not a sport (if sport it is) about which I know a great deal, other than that I know someone who owns a grouse moor up in Scotland.

As I understand it, when he hosts a shooting party (with paying guests) for the weekend, the guests are fortunate if they return home with even a couple of the birds to put in their freezers.

The problem is, too, at least according to him, that if he couldn't use the grouse moor for raising grouse and shooting some of them, he'd have little choice but to rent it out for agricultural use, which would be a shame because the moorland is worth preserving.

It costs him money to keep the land as a grouse moor, he says, even with EU grants and the money he makes from hosting shoots, but he doesn't mind because he enjoys the shooting. If he couldn't shoot on it, he'd get rid of it.

I am not defending his position, particularly -- just trying to explain the other point of view.
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Old 01-29-2018, 03:24 AM   #14 (permalink)
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I'd read that as hunting lions which had been bred in captivity, then released into the wild to be hunted - a bit like breeding pheasants to be shot in the UK.
You can raise a pheasant on a diet of low-quality grain in less than a year.

The average weight of a male lion is 200 kg and they don't have a fully developed mane until they're several years old, so you also need to consider the dozens of cows it consumes in its lifespan - in a part of the world that is still prone to famines and is currently experiencing a severe draught.

Also, you can eat pheasants - a lion's mane has no practical purpose.
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Old 01-29-2018, 04:11 AM   #15 (permalink)
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You can raise a pheasant on a diet of low-quality grain in less than a year. The average weight of a male lion is 200 kg and they don't have a fully developed mane until they're several years old, so you also need to consider the dozens of cows it consumes in its lifespan - in a part of the world that is still prone to famines and is currently experiencing a severe draught. Also, you can eat pheasants - a lion's mane has no practical purpose.
While what you say is perfectly true, what's the relevance to what I said ?
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Old 01-29-2018, 06:16 PM   #16 (permalink)
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While what you say is perfectly true, what's the relevance to what I said ?
The relevance is that saying "one is a bit like the other" is like comparing a Volkswagen Beetle to a cruise ship because they're both vehicles that burn fossil fuels.

While technically true, it's merely a superficial comparison that just shows a lack of perspective since one of the two emits a million times more CO2 than the other.

I'm not a fan of hunting as a "sport". I think that's at best a form of stone age nostalgia or misguided self-fulfilment trip - and at worst a bloody masturbation ritual for self-appointed "elites".

But if we're going to have to live with it, then it's better if those "hunters" kill animals that have been bred for this purpose rather than taking wild animals out of the ecosystem - IF they can be bred in a manner that keeps the impact on the environment to a minimum.

This can be done with pheasants, especially if you then take the income that's being generated to keep an area in a relatively natural state, like the guy Innula wrote about - but you can't do it with a cat that needs to eat between 10 and 20 lbs. of meat every day.

"Hunting" captive lions is just a total blight without redeeming qualities.

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Old 01-30-2018, 08:57 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Pretty much abandoned any pretense of "hunting" by that point.
Yeah, you are closer to a deli's butcher than a hunter if the animal can not even escape.
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Old 01-30-2018, 04:42 PM   #18 (permalink)
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The relevance is that saying "one is a bit like the other" is like comparing a Volkswagen Beetle to a cruise ship because they're both vehicles that burn fossil fuels.
I disagree - the pheasants aren't bred for food, they're bred for 'sport' - the only difference is the size.
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Old 01-30-2018, 05:21 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I disagree - the pheasants aren't bred for food, they're bred for 'sport' - the only difference is the size.
The size - and diet - of these animals are directly related to the net impact these breeding pens have on the environment.

How many times do I need to explain this to you until it gets through your thick skull?
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Old 01-30-2018, 08:35 PM   #20 (permalink)
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More importantly, if most of the birds escape into the wild, then its keeping the population up.
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Old 01-31-2018, 03:53 AM   #21 (permalink)
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The size - and diet - of these animals are directly related to the net impact these breeding pens have on the environment.
It's the practice of breeding animals purely to be hunted for 'sport' that I'm objecting to, regardless of size.

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How many times do I need to explain this to you until it gets through your thick skull?
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Old 01-31-2018, 09:40 AM   #22 (permalink)
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It's the practice of breeding animals purely to be hunted for 'sport' that I'm objecting to, regardless of size.
Do you see the practice of breeding, and maintaining a natural habitat for, game birds, some of which will be shot for sport (and then eaten later) but the vast majority of which will live out their natural lives, as more or less objectionable than a farmer breeding animals for slaughter?
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Old 01-31-2018, 03:40 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Do you see the practice of breeding, and maintaining a natural habitat for, game birds, some of which will be shot for sport (and then eaten later) but the vast majority of which will live out their natural lives, as more or less objectionable than a farmer breeding animals for slaughter?
I have no problem with breeding food-animals for slaughter, we are omnivores after all. I do have a problem with killing things for sport - if the 'vast majority' of game birds can live out their natural lives, why can't they all ?
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Old 01-31-2018, 03:49 PM   #24 (permalink)
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I only want to add that I think it's unfortunate that he was shot. Mauling would have been a much more equitable form of death.
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Old 01-31-2018, 04:22 PM   #25 (permalink)
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I have no problem with breeding food-animals for slaughter, we are omnivores after all. I do have a problem with killing things for sport - if the 'vast majority' of game birds can live out their natural lives, why can't they all ?
Because shooting game birds is quite difficult, so you need to have quite large flocks of them in order to stand a good chance of bagging a few.

If people weren't shooting them, then there would be no point in maintaining moorland and raising game birds on it, and most of them would end up being turned over to growing crops, so no game birds, other than truly wild ones.
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