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Old 01-21-2018, 08:50 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Arrow SLU Patreon

I've set up the ability to support SLU through Patreon - the link to subscribe is at the top right of the main pages in the Advertising section, and on the Support SLU page. The direct link is:

https://www.patreon.com/bePatron?u=7373755

You can support the site for as little as $1 per month, and Patreon lets you cancel at any time. I don't currently have any rewards setup through Patreon, but if you'd like to have the SLU Supporter tag added to your name here, just message me and I'll put you in that group. I will also add perks in the future once I figure out how Patreon works a bit more.

Thank you!
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Old 01-21-2018, 08:58 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Oh hey look at that, I can change it to be more if I want to...

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Old 01-21-2018, 09:46 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Old 01-21-2018, 10:07 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I'll send donations direct rather than through Patreon because Patreon will hit me for 20% tax and I see it then takes off a cut from the remainder as a handling charge, so it makes a lot more sense for me to use PayPal, so the whole of my donation goes where it's supposed to.
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Old 01-21-2018, 10:46 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Did Innula just bitch slap the Patreoners?
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Old 01-21-2018, 11:02 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Did Innula just bitch slap the Patreoners?
Maybe for Europeans.
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Old 01-22-2018, 11:04 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Did Innula just bitch slap the Patreoners?
When I tried to set up a Patreon donation, I discovered that they would debit me the donation plus 20% Value Added Tax, because my billing address is in the UK.

They justify that by saying they offer it as a convenience to the beneficiaries, many of whom provide gifts in return for donations (which EU tax authorities would regard as a sale, not an exchange of presents) and they're simply saving people the trouble of handling that side of things themselves.

I distrust that explanation, since I doubt many people who set up Patreons come anywhere near the turnover where they'd need to register for VAT in the first place, but certainly it doesn't apply in this case since Cristiano isn't, as yet, offering gifts of any kind.

That's why it makes a lot more sense for me to donate direct via PayPal, since I want to help out Cristiano and SLU, not the British Treasury or Patreon.

Patreon also make a small handling charge on all donations, which PayPal don't appear to levy on gifts, but it was really the VAT that put me off using Patreon.
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Old 01-22-2018, 11:15 AM   #8 (permalink)
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$1 no rewards

make the second tier
$10 -- NUDES!!!
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Old 01-22-2018, 11:17 AM   #9 (permalink)
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$1 no rewards

make the second tier
$10 -- NUDES!!!
SL nudes or RL nudes.
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Old 01-22-2018, 11:18 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ranae Quinn View Post
$1 no rewards

make the second tier
$10 -- NUDES!!!
Not sure Cristiano is *that* dedicated to keeping SLU going...
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Old 02-22-2018, 08:42 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Innula Zenovka View Post
When I tried to set up a Patreon donation, I discovered that they would debit me the donation plus 20% Value Added Tax, because my billing address is in the UK.

They justify that by saying they offer it as a convenience to the beneficiaries, many of whom provide gifts in return for donations (which EU tax authorities would regard as a sale, not an exchange of presents) and they're simply saving people the trouble of handling that side of things themselves.
My understanding is that theyíre correct. If you provide digital services to an EU resident, youíre obliged to charge and deliver VAT, wherever you as a creator may be located - here, Patreonís performing that service, rather than leaving the issue of whether or not to do so, and how, to the creators. Itís a complex issue, but you can check photography forums for confirmation of the validity of the matter.

Though it seems to be determined a bit oddly, as some of my pledges are VAT-levied, and some arenít, leading me to wonder if itís more to do with the IP address used when signing up for a given pledge, as I see VAT on some charges associated with my BofA account. I may just nuke them all and set them all up again, just to clear things up.
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Old 02-22-2018, 09:27 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Porsupah Ree View Post
My understanding is that theyíre correct. If you provide digital services to an EU resident, youíre obliged to charge and deliver VAT, wherever you as a creator may be located - here, Patreonís performing that service, rather than leaving the issue of whether or not to do so, and how, to the creators. Itís a complex issue, but you can check photography forums for confirmation of the validity of the matter.

Though it seems to be determined a bit oddly, as some of my pledges are VAT-levied, and some arenít, leading me to wonder if itís more to do with the IP address used when signing up for a given pledge, as I see VAT on some charges associated with my BofA account. I may just nuke them all and set them all up again, just to clear things up.
In principle, they're correct. In practice, though, I very much doubt many of the beneficiaries of a Patreon appeal have a turnover that would require them to register for VAT, but I can understand Patreon's approach.

However, in this case, there's clearly no question of Cristiano supplying goods or services in return for the donations, so VAT shouldn't be an issue. And it isnt so long as I send my donations direct via PayPal rather than via Patreon.
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Old 02-23-2018, 08:10 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Yup, I buy my extra slu cookies trough Paypal as well, no extra charges. Just the donation.
There is no such thing as VAT on (digital) money transfer.
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Old 03-01-2018, 03:14 PM   #14 (permalink)
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As an addendum, I've just updated all my pledges accordingly. Yay! From their helpdesk article:

Quote:
VAT is determined by your location when you either create a new pledge or edit your pledge.

To remove VAT from your pledge, you can update your pledge, or delete and re-pledge to your creator while you are in a country that does not charge VAT.
And the reason for it all:

Quote:
Starting in 2015, the European Union changed regulations for how VAT is calculated on sales of digital services. It is now determined by the location of the consumer, not the location of the business. This also applies to independent content creators like the ones on Patreon.

Instead of putting the burden on Patreon creators to collect and calculate VAT chargeable to EU-based patrons, Patreon will handle it. We will automatically present and collect VAT at the applicable rate from EU-based patrons, and we will also take care of the filing and remittance of VAT payments made by patrons for digital services provided by our creators through Patreon. Creators, whenever you see your patrons’ payments, account balances, etc. on Patreon, VAT chargeable to patrons for digital services has already been deducted.
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Old 03-01-2018, 04:11 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Porsupah Ree View Post
As an addendum, I've just updated all my pledges accordingly. Yay! From their helpdesk article:



And the reason for it all:
All I'm saying is that, in this particular case, there is, or should be, no VAT liability whatsoever because Cristiano isn't providing any goods or services in return for support on Patreon. Even if he were providing special gifts for donors, it wouldn't necessarily attract VAT until his turnover on goods and services supplied within the EU was greater than £70,000 (so about US$96,420) a year.

But it doesn't matter. Since the Patreon started I've been donating direct via PayPal, which ensures Cristiano receives all the money I send.
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