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Khamon

True, I've always approached telling Philip what Linden Lab should be doing with the software from the perspective that he invested the first millions and has every right to do as he pleases with the company and the product. Of course at this point, he has to answer to the other people who've invested in the project, well, not us, but the ones he calls investors.

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Sooz Pascale

Why is that, I wonder? Are those people being unreasonable? Are bug fixes, indeed, being given priority over the array of wonderous and mind boggling new features that enhance our SL existence? I DON'T THINK SO!!! SL still lags like crazy when the hordes of free accounts sign on during peak hours, teleporting fails about 1/3 of the time. Inventory losses are ramapnt, financial transaction often fail and there is still that oh so amusing giggle inducing hair and shoes up the butt little joke that LL so enjoys.

I am a well mannered person. If I ever met a Linden in world or in RL or in a social setting, I would not, as a matter of common courtesy, bring up these problems. That doesn't negate their existence, though.

The simple truth of the matter is that (1) LL is demonstrably unenthusiastic about fixing ANYTHING; (2) Screaming about it is about the only thing that gets them moving, albeitly reluctantly to do, or more accurately pretend to do anything about bug fixes; (3) the expression "resolved" as taken its own meaning [we fooled around with the problem, didn't fix it but are going to pretend that it is to shut you people up] which is FAR different from its usual meaning.

Now about Phillip Rosedale. YES!! I am not one of those who signed into the halcyon days of 2003, 2004, 2005 or even 2006. I have never met him.

I'm a bit unusual though. I tend to make my determinations about people based on what they DO, not what they say. My opinion on Mr. Rosedale is based mainly on the following: (1) He is the GENIUS who opened the floodgates to millions of free, unverified accounts despite tons of advice that such an action would make the amount of users impossible or difficult for the hardware to service and that it would encourage anti-social behavior such as griefing, scams and frauds; (2) He said that LL would insitute some controls to prevent unverifieds from logging on when peak usage started to negatively effect performance. I'm still waiting; (3) He has continually promised better efforts toward bug fixing and grid stability and , to my viewpoint, has not delivered; (4) He is CEO of a company that has almost ZERO customer service and arbitrary and capricious enforcement of niggling TOS violations while turning a blind eye to an amazing array of scams because the perpetrators are capable of writing cool code. The list goes on and on.

Flip, the rest of you guys can be as impressed as you want to with him, having met him. I believe the guy is a charismatic charmer. For myself, I would not believe him on anything of importance. I believe he is either incabable of differentiating between the truth and fiction or doesn't care.

I know you didn't say so in your post Flip, but just because some of us didn't join SL until 2007 or later doesn't make us idiots. It may be that not falling under his great one on one personal charisma, we can see it a little clearer?

Sooz

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Psyke Phaeton

Give Mono now!!!

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Cristiano

I'm not sure why you raised the point, if Flipper did not say it (nor anyone else did). It isn't a matter of being an idiot - it is a matter of having a different perspective on someone, that is all. You know I am in no way an apologist for Philip - like all of us he has his flaws. I have been very critical of LL and Philip in particular at times. I just don't think the man is all smoke and mirrors.

Good use of halcyon days, btw, I love that phrase.

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Cristiano

Wasn't having it in high school bad enough?

Fade Languish

Interestingly, you can visit pretty much any game forum and see the same themes. If I was to look at the Eve forums right now, they'll be screaming fix the bugs before adding new features, restrict the trials, stop growing the server canna handle it, zomg fix the lag, zomg griefers, that the customer service is non-existent and my personal favourite, the wait for the mythical competition, when all will be made right.

I can only tell the difference when someone says "can I have your stuff? - gb2 WOW."

Spaceman Opus

My story: Joined SL in May of 2006, just before the floodgates opened up. Never met Philip, or any Linden other than office hours and the rare appearance at welcome areas, etc.

For the bug fixing team, yes. For the Windlight, Havok, Mono teams, probably not. Keep in mind that Windlight, Havok and Mono all have stability improving qualities about them, so don't just count them as "features".



Disagree. I've been to a bunch of office hours lately and the Lindens there are chomping at the bit to solve problems brought to them.

Disagree again. I will readily agree with you that [RESOLVED] [OOPS] sucks, and sucks hard, but I really don't think they're doing it on purpose to calm the teeming masses. I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt here. As I said, yes, sucks, and yes...when I see [RESOLVED] I know it's gonna be a long night, but just to shut us up? Doubtful.

Hmmm...I'm going to agree with you here. I don't know about the advice against opening the floodgates, and I'll take your word for it. The throttling I do remember, and I'm still waiting too

Here's where I mainly disagree with you. SL's stability has increased a lot in the past year or so. Remember grid downtimes? Remember when it was supposed to be down from 6AM-Noon on a Wednesday and we couldn't get in til 5:00 PM Friday? That happened just over a year ago, if I recall correctly (entirely possible I don't tho ). Read Massively's Yesterday In Second Life feature. They have a Grid Stability Index there...the lower the number is, the better the stability on the previous day. Take a look at those over the past 3 months or so. The grid is more stable.

The viewer? Vertex Buffer Objects sped up texture loading. Windlight has new rendering code. Are there bugs? Sure. My friends list has about a 50/50 shot of loading when I log in. So you know what I do? I relog after I look at IM's and other pressing SL business if I have any. Takes all of a minute and a half. I guess I don't see it as that big of a deal. Same with attachments up the butt. It happens, I re-attach, problem solved.

Customer service, my viewpoint is different. I've had great experience from a couple days after I joined until this past week when I needed help verifying an alt. I read the horror stories, but my experience is different. TOS violations and scams I'm with you 100%.

Agreed, to a point. Again, never having met him, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, and call him a visionary, but it's long past time for the visionary to step aside and let a business person take the reins.

Red Kool-Aid colored glasses might tint things a little, but bad experiences can blur your vision just as badly.

my 2L

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prinţesă nină

i nominate gabe newell for ll ceo and john carmack for cto.
like phil, they are visionary, defined their genre, are open source-friendly, and are self made. unlike phil, they'd get shit done.

Beezle Warburton

Part of the reason it's so buggy is at some point LL got in over their heads. They're actually quite a small company to be doing this sort of extensive software development.

Making it open source would involve a far greater number of people working on fixes for it.

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Cocoanut Koala

OK, but see, that's sort of a bandaid.

I mean, assuming that the company can handle what they created, and can (*will agree to*) fix their own problems.

In which case, I don't see why.

coco

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Cristiano

Open source on its own is not a panacea for software development though. It has its own challenges and pitfalls. LL also needs to balance its own needs to be financially viable as well - open source poses both opportunities and risks in that regard as well.

Dnate Mars

Just for reference, here are all the bug fixes per the release notes for 1.18. This covers about the last 9 months.

Changes:

* Message system changes to support transport via TCP (HTTP) as well as UDP.
o More details are available here: A big change you’ll barely notice « Official Second Life Blog
o And here: Día de la Liberación « Official Second Life Blog
* German language added to the Windows installer
* Updated translations for German language viewer
* Updated translations for Japanese language viewer
* Updated translations for Korean language viewer
* Viewer "channel" (Release, First Look, etc) now visible at login in the lower right corner next to the version number

Bug fixes:

* Fixed SVC-286[c]: deleted fully-permissive objects owned by others skip trash
* Fixed SVC-251[c]: Death teleport fails when teleporting to a home point you no longer have access to
* Fixed MISC-273[c]: Enrollment fee is incorrectly deducted if you belong to max. # of groups and try to join new ones

1.18.1

Changes:

* Shortcut keys for menu items in the Client & Server menus are now disabled if the menus are hidden.
* Text from objects can be muted.

Bug fixes:

* VWR-1797[c]: Remove mention of "Live Help" from Crash Logger
* VWR-1732[c]: Pressing Enter, with multiple inventory objects selected, crashes viewer
* VWR-1729[c]: indra/lscript/lscript_compile/indra.l: avoid yyunput hack on Windows build
* VWR-1723[c]: Possible crash in llvopartgroup
* VWR-1706[c]: Minor quirk (and cleanup) in llfloater.cpp
* VWR-1705[c]: indra/lscript/lscript_compile/indra.y: disable compiler warning #4065 for 'switch' statements
* VWR-1704[c]: indra/llui/files.lst: delete llhtmlhelp.h entry
* VWR-1698[c]: Clean up parcel flag manipulation
* VWR-1655[c]: Script Warnings/errors window is hard to resize, resets size after closing tabs.
* VWR-1646[c]: Possible crash when login server is unavailable.
* VWR-1626[c]: Patch to avoid IM window from resizing when sessions open or close
* VWR-1613[c]: Overuse of virtual
* VWR-1612[c]: LLRenderPass:ushbatch and LLViewerImage::addTextureStats tuning
* VWR-1586[c]: Mismatched delete in llviewerparcelmgr.cpp
* VWR-1578[c]: Two quirks in IM regarding "xxxx is typing"
* VWR-1471[c]: Inspect (Pie menu > More > More > Inspect) shows nothing on first use when "only select own objects" is enabled
* VWR-1470[c]: Buttons (IM, Teleport, Profile, ...) in friends list are disabled when opening friends list window
* VWR-1468[c]: LoginPacketNeverReceived dialog text is incorrect
* VWR-1462[c]: Order of right-click menu on Inventory is confusing
* VWR-1453[c]: A few old-school changes for llviewerregion.cpp
* VWR-1434[c]: Null pointer crash when terraforming
* VWR-1406[c]: Unchecking "Go Away/AFK when idle" has no effect in 1.17.2.0
* VWR-1382[c]: Some scripted objects are highlighted in red while pressing Alt with tools open
* VWR-1381[c]: libpng12.a for MacOS X is missing in 1.17.1.0 and build fails.
* VWR-1358[c]: Physical objects remain red if tools window is closed while holding Alt key
* VWR-1358[c]: Physical objects remain red if tools window is closed while holding Alt key
* VWR-1353[c]: Misleading variable names in LLTextEditor
* VWR-1344[c]: Reverse order of popups, so that new ones appear underneath existing ones rather than on top.
* VWR-1318[c]: Selecting Cancel while saving a snapshot to disk still triggers snapshot gesture
* VWR-1314[c]: Multiple selection then individual deselection of attachments broken
* VWR-1294[c]: Possibly threads not fully cleaned up at end of program
* VWR-1289[c]: On logging in, sound volume for stream is low, despite the actual setting in the music control
* VWR-1282[c]: Better error handling when fonts are missing
* VWR-1270[c]: Script error window keeps reverting to a very small size
* VWR-1246[c]: Mac: File menu > Snapshot to Disk lists wrong shortcut key
* VWR-1105[c]: Set internal limit of particle count to max value from GUI preferences.
* VWR-1092[c]: Disable mouse hover text on HUDs, since it always only shows the owner's name and generally gets in the way of HUD functionality.
* VWR-727[c]: Torn of IM windows should be minimizable (was re: VWR-233: ... resizeable and minimizable)
* VWR-447[c]: Allow minimized windows to be repositioned in client
* VWR-353[c]: Rebake command - add a keyboard shortcut and put in tools menu
* VWR-349[c]: Change keyboard shortcuts, because entering { [ ] } on German and some other international keyboards (AltGr 7, 8, 9, 0) triggers Rendering Features accelerators Ctrl-Alt-7, 8, 9, 0 (previously resulting in unstable viewer)
* VWR-238[c]: Permissions of Roles and Rights in the german version are mased up.
* VWR-102[c]: md5 slow
* SVC-371[c]: Fix the legibility and grammar/consistency of the new llOwnerSay implementation
* SVC-193[c]: llParticleSystem - halo of rogue particles around original particle system after 1.15 update* SVC-373: Deleting a script's code results in a non-existent file and "missing from database" error
* Fixed preference for showing or hiding server combo box was not preserved
* Fixed residents with negative L$ balance can't purchase items set for sale "Original" or "Copy" that are being sold for L$0
* "Copy SLURL to clipboard" is now enabled for an avatar's current coordinates
* Macintosh viewer now correctly opens the map and selects the destination on a SLURL request
* Leading and trailing spaces are now automatically trimmed from parcel media URLs
* Corrected the spacing of the yellow "next dialog" chevron (was partially blocked by the Mute button)
* Corrected the error message shown when adding 11th Estate Manager
* Added CPU detection for Intel Core Duo/Solo and Intel Core 2 Duo
* "Set Window Size..." setting is now correctly resumed after being minimized
* Added link to Qa wiki in the viewer bug reporter menu.
* Updated text in Second Life Crash Logger with new support portal information
* Corrected an issue with UI font scaling in the bug reporter window

1.18.2

Bug fixes:

* VWR-1936[c]: Line editor history missing from First Look: Voice
* Adjusted thread priorities and buffering algorithms in SLVoice to improve performance on low-end machines
* Added a DC bias removal filter to SLVoice, which should remove "popping" artifacts heard with some microphones
* Fixed: Audio devices added to a system after launch of client do not appear in the device menu
* Fixed: The first time opening the prefs window after launch kicks the user out of their voice channel

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What the...

Dnate Mars

1.18.3

Bug fixes:

* Fixed default eyes appearing gray
* Fixed viewer source linking error
* Enrollment fees are no longer displayed with decimals
* Fixed inworld map region search failing if a space is included after the region name
* Fixed Appearance editor preview squares after changing tabs
* Fixed a bug with LODs for sculpted prims
* Fixed flexy causes llTargetOmega child objects to not rotate
* Fixed an incorrect Support link
* Fixed clipboard capture on login screen's config info
* Fixed web browser widget shows up blank when connecting via https
* Fixed doubleclicking text entry fields should select a single word first, then the entire field
* Fixed items renamed from Recent Items not displaying the correct name in All Items
* Fixed physical memory calls with more than 4GB of memory
* Fixed viewer crash by clicking Connect button repeatedly
* Fixed crash in viewer when receiving bad HUD Effects
* Fixed a Linux client crash
* Fixed client on 64-bit Linux systems that cannot find their GL drivers
* Improved Linux client threading
* Improved client performance after closing an inventory folder with a large number of items
* VWR-2487[c]: Covenant Details between live version and release candidate version
* VWR-2275[c]: Linux 1.18.3 Won't Link
* VWR-2152[c]: Possible crash in llviewerobjectlist
* VWR-2144[c]: Client crashes when deleting unsaved gestures
* VWR-2036[c]: Build tools floater does not remember its position on restart
* VWR-1987[c]: Segfault on startup if audio doesn't initialize.
* VWR-1976[c]: Solaris' fprintf segfaults on NULL arguments
* VWR-1968[c]: Possible crash in llmultigesture.cpp
* VWR-1951[c]: Hide Particles is not working from the View > Beacons menu item
* VWR-1942[c]: An error in the do-while example of the LSL Scripting Guide could cause infinite looping.
* VWR-1892[c]: Use pkgconfig for more libraries in the standalone build
* VWR-1891[c]: Detect a Debian bulid-host, as is done for Fedora
* VWR-1880[c]: Modify "Ctrl-F" to call Search/Replace Dialog when invoked inside Script Window
* VWR-1872[c]: An attempt to fix the "empty inventory trash" crashes
* VWR-1861[c]: Renaming items in inventory folders does not update item sort order
* VWR-1823[c]: Bad typecast for 64 bit systems, llagent llfloatercustomize
* VWR-1808[c]: Possible crash in llviewerobjectlist
* VWR-1761[c]: Group Invite Suggestion--add 'view group info' to invite dialog box
* VWR-1743[c]: LLFloaterGroups source code inconsistencies
* VWR-1736[c]: Add a Invite to Group option to the Avatar Pie Menu
* VWR-1722[c]: Profiles are editable in two places (including Search browser)
* VWR-1721[c]: GUI quirk in groups
* VWR-1714[c]: Folders flashing in Inventory window with Filters and 'Always show folders' checked
* VWR-1699[c]: Sculpt map preview inaccurate
* VWR-1647[c]: "Show end of last IM conversation" in Preferences/Communication automatically remains checked after OK-ing unchecked
* VWR-1640[c]: login retires cause LLFrameStatView::setup() to seg fault
* VWR-1638[c]: confused viewer - displays login and regular menus and buttons
* VWR-1567[c]: Change the default item name for "snapshot to inventory" to something more usefull than "snapshot"
* VWR-1566[c]: An attempt to fix the glDrawRangeElements crashes (refcount LLDrawInfo )
* VWR-1564[c]: Viewer crashes when started with the "-local" argument.
* VWR-1460[c]: Can not see permissions of objects in Buy Contents window when item has long name
* VWR-1398[c]: Appearance editor's previews do not render correctly (1.17.2)
* VWR-1372[c]: Sculpt prim topology reverts to sphere unexpectedly
* VWR-1230[c]: Text highlighting in Chat History window is cancelled when history scrolls
* VWR-1225[c]: Embedded notecards not functioning
* VWR-1187[c]: Profile > Classifieds tab shows confirmation dialog when no changes are made
* VWR-1079[c]: Group Notice dialog: message text can't be copied and pasted
* VWR-942[c]: logRanOffEndOfPacket is too terse when it logs packet data, add some more info
* VWR-866[c]: Sculpties suffer HORRIBLY from JPEG artifacts
* VWR-819[c]: Open the "More>>" section of the edit tools by default and persist it across sessions
* VWR-749[c]: Bandwidth indicator: Kbps, should not have capital k
* VWR-493[c]: Statistics bar, Packet Loss: % sign is doubled
* SVC-493[c]: Objects with "Linden" in their name can't be muted
* VWR-423[c]: Selecting group charter text causes Apply/Ignore/Cancel popup even if the text wasn't changed
* VWR-240[c]: Cannot input Japanese characters from keyboard on Linux
* SVC-300[c]: Spam upon TP out of Help Island Public, per calling card and landmark
1.18.4

Bug fixes:

* Fixed a sculptie LOD issue
* Fixed region Mature setting reverting to PG after Estate/Region changes
* Fixed several UI elements
* Fixed new group not appearing in group window until relog
* Fixed Trash folders in user inventory
* Fixed missing line of information on land sales
* Fixed parcel listings showing [AREA] instead of parcel size
* Fixed bad teleports from landmarks
* Fixed up/down arrows for Repeats Per Face
* Fixed a viewer nested message crash
* Fixed a viewer crash with editing classifieds
* Fixed a viewer crash when pressing Ctrl-F with a minimized Search window
* Fixed secondlife.log spam when group info window opens
* Fixed Publish on Web not saving for parcels
* Fixed missing dialog for Publish in Classifieds
* Fixed updates for Land and L$
* Fixed invisible sculpted prims when sculpted texture contains alpha
* Fixed scope of drag-select with locked objects
* Fixed link order of drag-selected objects
* Fixed Accept Notices flag in Group Panel General tab not saving value
* Fixed Linux viewer preferences for choosing the cache location or chat log location
* Fixed Apply button disabled after setting group preferences
* Fixed Apply button failing to grey out after selecting 'List Group in Profile'
* Fixed filename filter for Linux/GTK file picker
* Fixed Linux/GTK file picker not remembering most recent directory
* Fixed channel argument in Linux client
* Fixed muted particles not clearing
* Fixed Show in Search option not carrying over to copied object
* Fixed muted users disappearing from Active Speakers
* Fixed Mature content flag when searching All
* Fixed viewer crash when pasting/typing UTF8 text in the object For Sale price box
* Fixed Gesture Editor sounds not initialized
* Fixed Group enrollment fee accepting floating point
* Fixed 'Quiet Snapshots to Disk' and 'Disable Camera Constraints' not persisting across sessions
* Fixed dot characters in various fields
* Fixed a crash on startup (due to empty list of rewritten login URIs)
* Fixed a Viewer crash while trying to rez an object
* Fixed a crash when editing classifieds
* Fixed Land & L$ fields no longer update
* Fixed a crash by minimizing the search window followed by Ctrl+F
* Fixed parcel option doesnt save publish listing on the web setting
* Fixed texture editing user interface is confusing
* Fixed can't set Repeats Per Face with up/down arrows
* Fixed Auction ID and Land Description Overlap in the 'About Land' window
* Disabled Add to Outfit and Replace Outfit options on the top-level Clothing folder
* MISC-567[c]: Multiple system folders (e.g., '100 Lost and Found Folders') in inventory
* VWR-2471[c]: SL-viewer chrashes after opening the 10th group-info-window
* VWR-2444[c]: Menu background colors aren't settable in colors_base.xml
* VWR-2291[c]: LOD defaults are now too aggressive in RC 1.18.3
* VWR-2283[c]: Some changes to groups cannot be saved
* VWR-2116[c]: Viewer crashes when starting a new Group IM session under Japanese UI
* VWR-2104[c]: long avatar names overflow on the chat history window volume control/muting section
* VWR-2065[c]: Custom Snapshot setting do not save for next Snapshot
* VWR-2041[c]: Allow using voice component on another computer
* VWR-1945[c]: toolbox floater displays window elements incorrectly when minimized then moved.
* VWR-1944[c]: Active gestures sometimes fail to show in the Active Gestures list
* VWR-1888[c]: Characters missing in IM window
* VWR-1724[c]: HUD zoom snaps back after selecting another HUD object
* VWR-1695[c]: llGiveInventoryList objects spam the owner with messages when the recipient is in Busy mode
* VWR-1590[c]: Keyboard changes inventory selection after right-click
* VWR-1562[c]: llassert(mNumDescendantsSelected >= 0) with crash and loop. (Debug build)
* VWR-1448[c]: llSetText on non-root prims is unreliable (including after relogs)
* VWR-1408[c]: Online status viewable via Groups even if 'Make my online status visible only to my Friends' is set
* VWR-1399[c]: Client crashes when viewing details of an empty proposal window
* VWR-1096[c]: llPlaySound does not play whilst in HUD depending on HUD attachment point
* VWR-1045[c]: Client crashes with no warning when uploading corrupted TGA file
* VWR-851[c]: Viewer Crashes in high texture environments when moving or when panning with camera.
* VWR-813[c]: Recent Items tab shows folders with no matching items
* VWR-738[c]: SL crashes when loading with a GTK_IM scim module
* VWR-379[c]: Fix shell scripts to use bash and not sh when appropriate.
* VWR-333[c]: 'Unable to load gesture.' or 'Gesture is missing from database.' on login
* VWR-315[c]: Script changes in the editor may be cancelled because of lag

Dnate Mars

1.18.5

Fixes:

* SVC-930[c]: Prims set for sale - prices are incorrectly set when multiple prims taken to inventory and rezzed
* SVC-1125[c]: New Search: Beacons aren't shown when teleporting to regions with "Allow Direct Teleport" disabled
* VWR-1125[c]: Clicking Title Bar While Mouselook'd Repositions SL Window
* VWR-1137[c]: Inventory names out of sync after renaming via Properties window
* VWR-1145[c]: Unable To Connect help not available
* VWR-1162[c]: Land for sale includes L$1 parcels that are not actually for sale
* VWR-1350[c]: Color settings do not appear to be applied to LSL default text
* VWR-1475[c]: OpenJPEG always uploads single layer lossless images
* VWR-1590[c]: Keyboard changes inventory selection after right-click
* VWR-1627[c]: Classified metrics are reset to 0 when the ad is updated
* VWR-1651[c]: Add ability to open a partners profile whilst viewing an avatar's profile
* VWR-1774[c]: Some avatar positions result in no Z-axis arrow when editing attachments
* VWR-1873[c]: Typos in en-us locale file
* VWR-1919[c]: Remove texture UUID information from UI unless full-perm
* VWR-2030[c]: Avatar only turns half-way in Appearance Mode
* VWR-2142[c]: Parcel voice icon doesn't reflect disabled status if voice isn't used
* VWR-2256[c]: Mac updater directory permission issues
* VWR-2367[c]: Wrong handling of maximum length of Group Notice message
* VWR-2404[c]: lossless texture compression on small textures not lossless
* VWR-2410[c]: noise dot appear in chat window when clien running long with chatting.
* VWR-2411[c]: Possible crash in pipeline.cpp
* VWR-2412[c]: Possible crash drawpoolwater
* VWR-2421[c]: ATI