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Old 05-25-2012, 12:47 PM   #101 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Elysium Hynes View Post
There are a lot of comparisions there going tru the flicker account it would seem they are all coppybotting each others, all the major skin stores tbh.
Like Eata wrote, a lot of major skin makers use the same ressources - for instance, Human photo references and textures for artists - 3d.sk (NSFW!!!) is a site where you can buy photos of naked people for use in the creation of game ressources. If two skin makers end up using the same model's pictures to source from (which is not too unrealistic, as you'd want fairly young, non-tattooed, female, certain skintone, etc. models - also, the cheapest subscription has a limited selection of photos available) their skins might well have suspicious similarities.
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Old 05-25-2012, 12:50 PM   #102 (permalink)
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In general, at what point does LL normally remove content and ban in a DMCA case?
i wonder if the account is just on hold..like temp banned..
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Old 05-25-2012, 12:55 PM   #103 (permalink)
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that blog must be fake! .. i mean they say the court called Second Life an Online... GAME!!!
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Old 05-25-2012, 01:02 PM   #104 (permalink)
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In general, at what point does LL normally remove content and ban in a DMCA case?
That's what I'd really like to know. LL is obligated to take down content once they have a DMCA claim, if a counterclaim isn't received within a certain amount of time (or immediately and restored upon receipt of a counterclaim, I've seen LL go both routes before). But the Banning part is completely at LL's discretion and I am not clear what LL uses as criteria for that (if anything).
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Old 05-25-2012, 01:07 PM   #105 (permalink)
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I have spoken to Gala, she said she found herself DMCA'd, countered but now had her content removed and been banned. She was not clear on if the injunction has been confirmed as real or not.
Vaki says:

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If Gala has only heard about it from a blog and hasn't actually been served process, then the injunction either isn't real or is only interim (basically a temporary restraining order), and I'd be very puzzled if someone could convince a court that the situation was so urgent that an interim injunction was necessary.
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Old 05-25-2012, 01:18 PM   #106 (permalink)
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You could buy enhancments, de um deflated? Right, you could buy cleavage layers from Curio, and you could buy layers that "shrank" your breasts. Difference in how light or heavy the markings were. Came on undershirts or tattoo layer. So Curio did have cleavage options.
But its not on the skins directly.

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that is interesting seeing according to the SL marketplace "Hush Darkrose" did not join SL untill Nov 10th 2010. (or is that the day she first listed on the marketplace?)

though of course Hush could be a alt for an older character so that may mean nothing.
Darkrose is a 2010 last name, or at least its when I got it for an alt of my own. So its very likely that the account was created in 2010 as well.
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Old 05-25-2012, 01:29 PM   #107 (permalink)
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If Gala has only heard about it from a blog and hasn't actually been served process, then the injunction either isn't real or is only interim (basically a temporary restraining order), and I'd be very puzzled if someone could convince a court that the situation was so urgent that an interim injunction was necessary.
If Gala as the accused party in this setup never got any note from any court, any decent lawyer should be up in arms about a serious procedural error. It can't be that different in Canada.

And if this is merely a setup, I strongly hope that a certain someone gets burned extremely bad in RL.
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Old 05-25-2012, 01:34 PM   #108 (permalink)
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Hey. Someone -- I suppose it was Ann? -- passed me the link to this thread. I suppose I should stay out of it, but what the hell, I'm not busy today.

So...I don't know Canadian law very well. I'm not a lawyer in Canada, I'm not authorized to practice law in Canada, I can't really speak for Canadians and their wacky laws. But I can say that Canadian injunctions work pretty much like American injunctions: there are three kinds, and they're granted at three different points in a trial, and they have different requirements. You can get an uncontested interim injunction (they're called ex parte) if you can convince a court that there's great urgency. You see them in divorces when one spouse is concerned another might disappear with the kids, or in counterfeiting cases when you want to make sure the counterfeiter doesn't destroy the goods before trial.

If there's not a sense of urgency, and time isn't a factor, courts want to make sure both parties are represented before imposing a burden on one party. In the US, that's part of due process; I'm not sure what the Canadian equivalent is, but I'm pretty sure it's there, because I know that both parties are represented in hearings for an interlocutory injunction (what we in the US know as a preliminary injunction). A plaintiff can get one of those before trial, but only if she convinces the court -- after hearing the defendant's side -- that she needs one. In Canada, the test for an interlocutory injunction is different from the test for a preliminary injunction, but the basics are the same: they're granted at the same time, for the same purpose. You see them granted to stop (or require) an activity for the duration of the trial (so if someone is selling infringing goods, a preliminary injunction could require them to stop sales for the duration of the trial). The key here is that you don't get one of these unless the other side has a chance to contest it.

Now, a permanent injunction in Canada and a permanent injunction in the US are pretty much the same: they're what you get if you win a trial. If you go to trial, prove your case, and the court holds in your favor, you get to tell the other person what to do (more or less. I'm simplifying). You can tell them to stop selling their infringing items forever. But first, you have to win. And in order to win, first, you have to go to court. And so does the other person.

So that's what those are. And that's why I'm dubious. Now, there may be way more to this than we've heard...but that's always the case, isn't it?

Um, standard disclaimers apply. I'm not giving anybody legal advice. This forum post does not create a confidential relationship. Blah blah blah.
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Old 05-25-2012, 01:51 PM   #109 (permalink)
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Wait so Gala has been banned from what i understand? by LL?
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Old 05-25-2012, 02:00 PM   #110 (permalink)
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LL seems to be rather selective about banning people and DMCA claims.

In about 75% of the cases when I have to file a DMCA, the accounts responsible remain on the grid, despite infringing content having been acknowledged and removed by LL.

All of a sudden, one (somewhat dubious) filing against Gala and she's banned?
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Old 05-25-2012, 02:06 PM   #111 (permalink)
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All of a sudden, one (somewhat dubious) filing against Gala and she's banned?
This seems really fishy.
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Old 05-25-2012, 02:08 PM   #112 (permalink)
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Given that it seems to be really, really, really hard lately to land a ban on any permissions infringement and even repeated sim crashers...hahah, oh wow. I'd so love to hear the story behind this one.
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Old 05-25-2012, 02:10 PM   #113 (permalink)
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Given that it seems to be really, really, really hard lately to land a ban on any permissions infringement and even repeated sim crashers...hahah, oh wow. I'd so love to hear the story behind this one.
It´s pretty hard to get anyone banned for copybot. This is extremely weird.
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Old 05-25-2012, 02:21 PM   #114 (permalink)
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Cris's google fu is impressive, I googled "gala curio skins" to see if I could find something and this thread is already #3 on the list!
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Old 05-25-2012, 02:28 PM   #115 (permalink)
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i wonder if the account is just on hold..like temp banned..
Her profile is still there, both on the website and in in-world search, which looks more like being on hold than banned. But maybe not.
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Old 05-25-2012, 02:29 PM   #116 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Kirari Kujisawa View Post
Cris's google fu is impressive, I googled "gala curio skins" to see if I could find something and this thread is already #3 on the list!
Actually it's more to do with Google giving you personal results.

It's a far superior algorithm meant to give you an echo chamber of information you already know. :|
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Old 05-25-2012, 02:58 PM   #117 (permalink)
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Someone I know that had to deal with aggressive dmca attacks was required to submit rl identification before the counter was allowed to proceed. And it still required lawyer intervention to "remind" LL to restore account status and content. So it took an extra week.
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Old 05-25-2012, 04:17 PM   #118 (permalink)
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Well that was annoying. Trying to search while on phone is frustrating.

Without looking at Hush Skins blog, the earliest reference I could find for Hush Skins turned out to be on Hush creators Flickr account. Oct 5 2009. New Hush Skins by Vixen - a set on Flickr
Was curious.

(I should add that, for whatever it is worth, you can fake the date on Flickr. You just go to picture and change upload date. Hmm. Been awhile. Or is it you can change date taken date and if that before date uploaded it replaces that date? Mmphs can't remember. Been years, literally)
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Old 05-25-2012, 04:31 PM   #119 (permalink)
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Actually it's more to do with Google giving you personal results.

It's a far superior algorithm meant to give you an echo chamber of information you already know. :|
Escape your search engine Filter Bubble! - Great explanation here.
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Old 05-25-2012, 04:49 PM   #120 (permalink)
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I have spoken to Gala, she said she found herself DMCA'd, countered but now had her content removed and been banned. She has not been able to confirm the injunction yet.
I really hope that this sort of crappery doesn't sour Gala from working in the virtual world (TM). Gala was where I bought my first real skin as a noob in 2007 and I've adored her stuff ever since, even when I (eventually) branched out and bought other skins.

This whole story stinks to high heaven, and if it's true (as seems likely) that Hush (who I've never heard of) is fabricating this, then I hope that the reprisals are swift and complete. DAMN I feel like grabbing a pitchfork atm.
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Old 05-25-2012, 05:19 PM   #121 (permalink)
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Old 05-25-2012, 05:20 PM   #122 (permalink)
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Well that was annoying. Trying to search while on phone is frustrating.

Without looking at Hush Skins blog, the earliest reference I could find for Hush Skins turned out to be on Hush creators Flickr account. Oct 5 2009. New Hush Skins by Vixen - a set on Flickr
Was curious.
The earliest reference I was able to find to Vixen skins was 2008. The cached version of the Hush skins "about" page has a link to a blog pic from November, 2008:


Looking at the above pic, this doesn't look very similar to Curio's skins released in February of 2009. Gala's third-generation skins (2009 and later) have fairly defined and distinctive collarbones which are not visible in this image, but interestingly, the "Vixen Hush" image from October of 2009...over seven months after the Curio skins were released...appears to have shading in this area that's similar if not identical to the Curio skins and very different to the Vixen skin of 2008.

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Old 05-25-2012, 05:28 PM   #123 (permalink)
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Just for giggles I took one of those "paired" shots off flickr, separated the pair onto superimposed layers, erased the white background and then normalized both, which nicely made the differently shaded skin tones match. I then looked closely at a couple of places a mole or freckle existed in one image and didnt in the other.

First place I looked, image A had a mole, image B had a patch of darker skin tone where that mole was blurred out.
Second place I looked, image B has a dark freckle, image A does not and no sign of it ever having been there or a blur tool ever having been used on those pixels.

So... of the 3 possible scenarios (1: A was ripped from B, 2: B was ripped from A, 3: A and B were created independently photosourced from the same model) this result is only compatible with scenarios 2 and 3.

Everyone with any computer image analysis experience (including me) will tell you that without a much more rigorous process than that this proves nothing. But them coincidences sure do be piling up.
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Old 05-25-2012, 05:30 PM   #124 (permalink)
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It is a seven day ban
Assuming it's simply because of this interlocutory injunction (rather than, for example, because she swore at the Linden who told her about it), to my mind, that puts LL in contempt of the court that's going to try the case.
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Old 05-25-2012, 06:16 PM   #125 (permalink)
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A quick hi to all. I don't usually post on SLU.

First: I have seen the court docs in question. They are real. Hush has been transparent in all her dealings.
Second: This is not a DMCA. This is a Supreme Court Injunction directing Linden Lab to remove infringing content. The docs are not what those in US are familiar with since this was issued from Canada. The word "wilful" might have been a typo, or it may be an alternate spelling. The injunction is the result of copyright registration shown and evidence submitted to the court. This was a court order, not a DMCA take down. Beyond all of that ...I'm not a lawyer. I can't comment on the law. I would suggest that those curious, should contact VIPO (Virtual Intellectual Property Organization) and ask one of the lawyers about it. ...Just a thought.

This is a crazy thing to wrap our thoughts around. Thing is...If this was a hoax, Curio skins would not have been taken down. They have been. I have always been a staunch supporter of Intellectual Property Rights and Awareness. The biggest danger to our community is in the witch hunts.

To clarify one thing, to my knowledge Hush/Verikai never had a DMCA filed against her from Truth. As I understand it, that incident was a misunderstanding caused by a 3rd party con artist who tricked Hush into buying stolen sculpts. The hair in question was never sold and as soon as Hush found out, she removed them. Her response was immediate

I've enjoyed reading the thread and the interesting quote from the attorney. Thank you for reading my post...(If you've gotten this far! lol)
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