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Kara Spengler · 03-08-2011, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mysty Saunders

Linux is very easy, windows is harder, I don't own a mac so ill take the 5th amendment on compiling there. If anyone needs help you can message me in world

A while ago I promised to write build instructions (with screenshots) detailing each little step. I have the screen shots made I just need to assemble them. Hopefully Ill have something soon if my bipolar (excuse me biwinning) doesn't keep clouding my mind!

This is what I do on Mac OSX:

Code:

cd /Users/someuser/firestorm_build

if the first build -->
hg clone http://hg.phoenixviewer.com/phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/

otherwise -->
hg pull
hg update default (or a specialised branch)

mkdir -p phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/include
mkdir -p phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin
mkdir -p phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin/lib_debug
mkdir -p phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin/lib_release
cp -p fmodapi375mac/api/inc/*.h phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/include
lipo -create fmodapi375mac/api/lib/libfmod.a  fmodapi375mac/api/lib/libfmodx86.a  -output phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin/lib_debug/libfmod.a
touch -r fmodapi375mac/api/lib/libfmodx86.a phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin/lib_debug/libfmod.a
cp -p phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin/lib_debug/libfmod.a phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin/lib_release/libfmod.a
cd phoenix-firestorm-lgpl

./build_firestorm_macosx.sh

You might just need the hg command(s) and to run the build script. I am not sure if the fmod stuff needs to be done for every build. Tonya?

Jack Abraham · 03-08-2011, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whisper

ummm, abuse reports are out of the question then?

Abuse reports do not address the problem of someone on your land actively causing disruptions. My process is to start an AR to get the screen shot, eject & ban, then finish filing the AR.

Casey Pelous · 03-08-2011, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S. Snowflake

Does that mean that Quickware is totally gone?

(Or am I having wishful thinking again?)

*sniffs* Smells like toast burning to me ..... "In the absence of a good faith effort" is mighty powerful corporate type language.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brenda Connolly

Quote:

Motherfucking bratwurst, yo.

Not sayin' nothin' about Joshua, since I'm not his type anyway, but how come so often they say:

When what they mean is:

Just sayin' ........

Brenda Connolly · 03-08-2011, 04:00 PM

So as the saga continues the lesson learned is that the virtual world is full of the same asshat douchebags as the real world, which isn't really that surprising. Phil said that part of the reason for SL was to improve the Human Condition. Unfortunately, the Human Condition will never improve as long as humans are involved.

This whole drama doesn't affect me that much...I rarely turn on a media stream, I almost never go to clubs or performances, and I'll just use the CV security thingie when I do if I am at a place I am not totally trusting of. I don't have alts, nor forsee ever having one. I am sympathetic to those whose SL's are negatively impacted by this. SL has always been a place for me to get away from the garbage of RL, but I guess it is naive to think it wouldn't find it's way there.

I've never taken SL or VW's as seriously as many here do, it's just escapist entertainment for me, and things like this only reinforce that view..

Inara Pey · 03-08-2011, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sling Trebuchet

What the guy is doing is a forewarning of what will happen with any TOS change that attempts to define something in detail.
It will be nit-picked to death, with the spirit of the thing discarded.

Which is why such things do tend to end up boilerplated.

The text, as given, is far from perfect - it is certainly far from "detailed".

Quote:

One thing that has to be done is to clearly distinguish between IPs as simply recorded in server logs - and IPs that are either processed out of the logs or processed out of content request URLs.
It has been the constant assertion from the dark side that there is no difference between the two.
If the distinction is not made then normal innocuous streams and web content come under a relatively draconian set of possible restrictions.

Agreed - which again is why Casey and I worked to ensure that the wording left sufficient room to allow for legitimate uses. Is it enough? Probably not, but it is a first stab attempt to indicate to LL what might be required. That's a start.

Quote:

What is central is the use to which the information is put. If the logs are processed in any way to make use of the information, then you have a situation that requires examination.
If the IPs, etc simply happen to be in logfiles because of normal server operation, then there should not be a problem.

That's pretty obvious, and no-one is saying otherwise.

Quote:

What precisely the in-world objects do is not important. They only come up for action if they are part of an overall system that is harvesting data related to avatars.
Any wording that looks at the objects in isolation is going to run foul of nit-picking.

And the wording does that, does it not? It puts the objects in question into a clear context. If anything has been missed, then the words have already been thrown out here for review, comment, suggestions - feel free to make them.

Quote:

LL's authority does not extend outside of LL's network. The in-world in themselves are not necessarily logging all the information that ends up on a third-party server. They can however be deemed to be an in-world part of a system that is an abuse, and therefore open to action by LL.

Which was my point to start with in my reply to Casey. The objects are in-world. They are actionable by LL.

If the harvesting process is rooted through LL's server, they can take action - that to me seems to be the spirit of Kara's revision.

No-one is saying that LL have authority over 3rd party servers; rather they have the authority to determine whether objects and scripts hosted on their own servers are communicating with 3rd party servers in a way that is "beneficial" or "benevolent" where the interests of their users are concerned.

**bronxelf** · 03-08-2011, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sling Trebuchet

What the guy is doing is a forewarning of what will happen with any TOS change that attempts to define something in detail.
It will be nit-picked to death, with the spirit of the thing discarded.

One thing that has to be done is to clearly distinguish between IPs as simply recorded in server logs - and IPs that are either processed out of the logs or processed out of content request URLs.
It has been the constant assertion from the dark side that there is no difference between the two.
If the distinction is not made then normal innocuous streams and web content come under a relatively draconian set of possible restrictions.

What is central is the use to which the information is put. If the logs are processed in any way to make use of the information, then you have a situation that requires examination.
If the IPs, etc simply happen to be in logfiles because of normal server operation, then there should not be a problem.

What precisely the in-world objects do is not important. They only come up for action if they are part of an overall system that is harvesting data related to avatars.
Any wording that looks at the objects in isolation is going to run foul of nit-picking.

LL's authority does not extend outside of LL's network. The in-world in themselves are not necessarily logging all the information that ends up on a third-party server. They can however be deemed to be an in-world part of a system that is an abuse, and therefore open to action by LL.

Agreeing with Sling here that no matter how tight the language (and it does need to be tight, so everyone who ran with my initial one sentence version is correct here), what this needs is for someone to be in charge on the back end who is willing to simply remove these kinds of devices wherever they are found, period. No weaseling, no nothing. They need to run this thing down like any other sim owner- you have it? It's gone. No discussion. Removed. When the whining starts? "These are the rules. Have a nice day."

All the language in the world wont help until someone (Hi Soft!) is given the free handed authority to rip this thing out by its roots whenever and wherever it's found.

**bronxelf** · 03-08-2011, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Casey Pelous

*sniffs* Smells like toast burning to me ..... "In the absence of a good faith effort" is mighty powerful corporate type language.

Not sayin' nothin' about Joshua, since I'm not his type anyway, but how come so often they say:

When what they mean is:

Just sayin' ........

I blame you for this, Casey.

YouTube - ‪Jackie Beat - Baby Got Front‬‏

Eva Ryan · 03-08-2011, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S. Snowflake

Does that mean that Quickware is totally gone?

(Or am I having wishful thinking again?)

That's the way I read it as. It's blacklisted; meaning, it won't rez inworld.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brenda Connolly

So as the saga continues the lesson learned is that the virtual world is full of the same asshat douchebags as the real world, which isn't really that surprising. Phil said that part of the reason for SL was to improve the Human Condition. Unfortunately, the Human Condition will never improve as long as humans are involved.

This whole drama doesn't affect me that much...I rarely turn on a media stream, I almost never go to clubs or performances, and I'll just use the CV security thingie when I do if I am at a place I am not totally trusting of. I don't have alts, nor forsee ever having one. I am sympathetic to those whose SL's are negatively impacted by this. SL has always been a place for me to get away from the garbage of RL, but I guess it is naive to think it wouldn't find it's way there.

I've never taken SL or VW's as seriously as many here do, it's just escapist entertainment for me, and things like this only reinforce that view..

It's not that I have much to risk in on this issue, I don't. It's the whole principle of the issue. I just don't like someone taking advantage of the system for their own wants and satisfaction of feeling powerful.

Argent Stonecutter · 03-08-2011, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sling Trebuchet

One thing that has to be done is to clearly distinguish between IPs as simply recorded in server logs - and IPs that are either processed out of the logs or processed out of content request URLs.

Perhaps a better way would be - distinguishing between IPs and IPs correlated with account or avatar identities.

George Orellana · 03-08-2011, 04:14 PM

For some reason since a few days ago my fps have dropped dramatically and the only viewer I can get 25fps (I'm on a wireless network) is Kirstens latest build. Unfortunately Sione's patch is not in it, and I'm tired of waiting on the Phoenix folks to do anything with Firestorm so is there a way I can add the patch to Kirstens manually? if so how? any help will be greatly appreciated.

Casey Pelous · 03-08-2011, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bronxelf

I blame you for this, Casey.

I ...........I didn't.............it's ........no but..........I .............uh ........

Eva Ryan · 03-08-2011, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George Orellana

For some reason since a few days ago my fps have dropped dramatically and the only viewer I can get 25fps (I'm on a wireless network) is Kirstens latest build. Unfortunately Sione's patch is not in it, and I'm tired of waiting on the Phoenix folks to do anything with Firestorm so is there a way I can add the patch to Kirstens manually? if so how? any help will be greatly appreciated.

As far as I know, the only V2 viewer with the media patch is Dolphin Viewer 2. You can download it here: Download and Install » Dolphin Viewer

Tonya Souther · 03-08-2011, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kara Spengler

Code:

mkdir -p phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/include
mkdir -p phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin
mkdir -p phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin/lib_debug
mkdir -p phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin/lib_release
cp -p fmodapi375mac/api/inc/*.h phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/include
lipo -create fmodapi375mac/api/lib/libfmod.a  fmodapi375mac/api/lib/libfmodx86.a  -output phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin/lib_debug/libfmod.a
touch -r fmodapi375mac/api/lib/libfmodx86.a phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin/lib_debug/libfmod.a
cp -p phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin/lib_debug/libfmod.a phoenix-firestorm-lgpl/libraries/universal-darwin/lib_release/libfmod.a
cd phoenix-firestorm-lgpl

These steps need only be done once. Once it's been set up, all you need to do to update is:

Code:

hg pull -u
./build_firestorm_macosx.sh

Brenda Connolly · 03-08-2011, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eva Ryan

That's the way I read it as. It's blacklisted; meaning, it won't rez inworld.

It's not that I have much to risk in on this issue, I don't. It's the whole principle of the issue. I just don't like someone taking advantage of the system for their own wants and satisfaction of feeling powerful.

Once again, SL mimics RL.

George Orellana · 03-08-2011, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eva Ryan

As far as I know, the only V2 viewer with the media patch is Dolphin Viewer 2. You can download it here: Download and Install » Dolphin Viewer

I have tried it, and I get lower fps with it. Also I don't like the UI

Sling Trebuchet · 03-08-2011, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inara Pey

Which is why such things do tend to end up boilerplated.

The text, as given, is far from perfect - it is certainly far from "detailed".
.....................

Please don't take my posts as a criticism in anyway.
Take them as another way of putting things, that might have a different slant that could add to the whole.

My previous post was influenced by Ash in the JIRA nit-picking about the in-world devices not actually trnasmitting IPs.
I wouldn't bother discussing it with him in the JIRA. He wants to set the rules of engagement to suit him, and it's boring the pants off all the watchers.
--- despite it's being the only show in town as a LL-owned platform where the thing is permitted to be discussed.

With Soft asking for that JIRA to be confined to alt-disclosure, then there seems to be no LL property on which discussion of TOS/CS on the general area of Privacy will be tolerated.

Soft suggests that discussions be moved to other JIRAs or the Forums "as appropriate".
But... JIRA is not really the right place for discussion of Policy. That was the reason that Oz gave for closing that particular JIRA in the early days.
And .... the mods seem to be hitting threads in the Forums.

There is a 'smell to coffee' that LL consider the CS change re alt disclosure to be the end of the entire matter.
Data harvesting in general isn't their concern it seems.

S. Snowflake · 03-08-2011, 04:29 PM

I did a search for the maker of Quickware (as stated in the Marketplace) in world aka Guy Quicksand ..."None Found"

Ezian Ecksol · 03-08-2011, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S. Snowflake

I did a search for the maker of Quickware (as stated in the Marketplace) in world aka Guy Quicksand ..."None Found"

Possibly has disabled "Show in search" in his profile (or ...), so I cannot find in inworld search, too, but in offworld search:

Guy Quicksand

Edit: Oh, following the inworld profile link, it says, of course, the profile has been deactivated.

http://my.secondlife.com/guy.quicksand

Theia Magic · 03-08-2011, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ezian Ecksol

Possibly has disabled "Show in search" in his profile, so I cannot find in inworld search, too, but in offworld search:

Guy Quicksand

A quote from Guy Quicksand's offworld profile:

"For Support on QuickWare Alts, please send an email to info@quickware.net.
WE DO NOT MAINTAIN THIS SYSTEM ANYMORE !!!
Someone else has taken over this project !!"

... I read that as "I'm using the product secretly on an alt".

Evola · 03-08-2011, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ezian Ecksol

Possibly has disabled "Show in search" in his profile, so I cannot find in inworld search, too, but in offworld search:

Guy Quicksand

I'm pretty sure it doesn't hide profiles from People tab in Search, at least in non v2 viewers. He's gone.

Karen · 03-08-2011, 04:43 PM

Funny that someone who made a product like this(Quickware) has complained about being accused of being a copybot, invasion of privacy and is complaining about the DMCA process.

"At 18 January we where acused of having infringed copyrighted works in the Second Life. We defended and this is resolved. If needed we will go to court !! What i found troubeling is that we never know who accused us or on what grounds. Creators Beware !!!: DMCA can be used to retrieve a creators private name and adress without the acuser need to indentify. This is U.S law, but it violates our rights for privacy.CopyrightAt 18 January we where acused of having infringed copyrighted works in the Second Life. We defended and this is resolved. If needed we will go to court !! What i found troubeling is that we never know who accused us or on what grounds. Creators Beware !!!: DMCA can be used to retrieve a creators private name and adress without the acuser need to indentify. This is U.S law, but it violates our rights for privacy.CopyrightAt 18 January we where acused of having infringed copyrighted works in the Second Life. We defended and this is resolved. If needed we will go to court !! What i found troubeling is that we never know who accused us or on what grounds. Creators Beware !!!: DMCA can be used to retrieve a creators private name and adress without the acuser need to indentify. This is U.S law, but it violates our rights for privacy.CopyrightAt 18 January we where acused of having infringed copyrighted works in the Second Life. We defended and this is resolved. If needed we will go to court !! What i found troubeling is that we never know who accused us or on what grounds. Creators Beware !!!: DMCA can be used to retrieve a creators private name and adress without the acuser need to indentify. This is U.S law, but it violates our rights for privacy.CopyrightAt 18 January we where acused of having infringed copyrighted works in the Second Life. We defended and this is resolved. If needed we will go to court !! What i found troubeling is that we never know who accused us or on what grounds. Creators Beware !!!: DMCA can be used to retrieve a creators private name and adress without the acuser need to indentify. This is U.S law, but it violates our rights for privacy.

Sling Trebuchet · 03-08-2011, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Argent Stonecutter

Perhaps a better way would be - distinguishing between IPs and IPs correlated with account or avatar identities.

The simpler the wording the better.
...provided that a bunch of Devil's Advocates try their best to destroy it and that the proposers of the wording see this as a useful exercise and no as an attack.

Cristiano...maybe we need a Devils Advocate 'smiley'.
Or we need to flag that mode in some standard way so that people do not misunderstand the intent.

Maybe 'kittyball'? That's probing at something

We already have a lawyer 'smiley'

I can't believe that I'm advocating animated emoticons. Poor Cole Sear.

Eva Ryan · 03-08-2011, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evola

I'm pretty sure it doesn't hide profiles from People tab in Search, at least in non v2 viewers. He's gone underground.

/fixed

Ezian Ecksol · 03-08-2011, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evola

I'm pretty sure it doesn't hide profiles from People tab in Search, at least in non v2 viewers. He's gone.

yes.
http://my.secondlife.com/guy.quicksand

Eva Ryan · 03-08-2011, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karen

Funny that someone who made a product like this has complained about being accused of being a copybot, invasion of privacy and is complaining about the DMCA process.

"<RANT>

For someone that is an "awesome" scripter; he can't spell worth a flying fuck.

03-08-2011, 04:43 PM	#446 (permalink)
Karen Senior Member GZ Terrorist Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Cloud Nine USA Posts: 649 My Mood: SL Join Date: 2007 Client: Cool VL	Funny that someone who made a product like this(Quickware) has complained about being accused of being a copybot, invasion of privacy and is complaining about the DMCA process. "At 18 January we where acused of having infringed copyrighted works in the Second Life. We defended and this is resolved. If needed we will go to court !! What i found troubeling is that we never know who accused us or on what grounds. Creators Beware !!!: DMCA can be used to retrieve a creators private name and adress without the acuser need to indentify. This is U.S law, but it violates our rights for privacy.CopyrightAt 18 January we where acused of having infringed copyrighted works in the Second Life. We defended and this is resolved. If needed we will go to court !! What i found troubeling is that we never know who accused us or on what grounds. Creators Beware !!!: DMCA can be used to retrieve a creators private name and adress without the acuser need to indentify. This is U.S law, but it violates our rights for privacy.CopyrightAt 18 January we where acused of having infringed copyrighted works in the Second Life. We defended and this is resolved. If needed we will go to court !! What i found troubeling is that we never know who accused us or on what grounds. Creators Beware !!!: DMCA can be used to retrieve a creators private name and adress without the acuser need to indentify. This is U.S law, but it violates our rights for privacy.CopyrightAt 18 January we where acused of having infringed copyrighted works in the Second Life. We defended and this is resolved. If needed we will go to court !! What i found troubeling is that we never know who accused us or on what grounds. Creators Beware !!!: DMCA can be used to retrieve a creators private name and adress without the acuser need to indentify. This is U.S law, but it violates our rights for privacy.CopyrightAt 18 January we where acused of having infringed copyrighted works in the Second Life. We defended and this is resolved. If needed we will go to court !! What i found troubeling is that we never know who accused us or on what grounds. Creators Beware !!!: DMCA can be used to retrieve a creators private name and adress without the acuser need to indentify. This is U.S law, but it violates our rights for privacy. Last edited by Karen; 03-08-2011 at 04:51 PM.

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03-08-2011, 04:14 PM	#435 (permalink)
George Orellana Member I'm the alt of someone's alt Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: U.S. Posts: 40 My Mood: Client: Phoenix	For some reason since a few days ago my fps have dropped dramatically and the only viewer I can get 25fps (I'm on a wireless network) is Kirstens latest build. Unfortunately Sione's patch is not in it, and I'm tired of waiting on the Phoenix folks to do anything with Firestorm so is there a way I can add the patch to Kirstens manually? if so how? any help will be greatly appreciated.

03-08-2011, 04:29 PM	#442 (permalink)
S. Snowflake Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 14 My Mood:	I did a search for the maker of Quickware (as stated in the Marketplace) in world aka Guy Quicksand ..."None Found"

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