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sezmra · 06-17-2008, 07:50 PM

Sigh.

I never wanted to be one of those people who pull the "I'M NOT GOING TO CREATE ANY NEW XYZ UNTIL LL FIXES THIS!!!" card.

Nope. I think it's just time to retire all together.

**Stroker Serpentine** · 06-17-2008, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solomon Devoix

In his rant here, Stroker also conveniently left out this bit from the blog:

Despite several people saying this is NOT true (including at least one furniture maker who had their stuff shredded by this little purge) Stroker maintains that anyone whose content was broken by the removal of the LEGITIMATELY USED scripts is either a thief (they all used the stolen animations, too, he says, in every single case) or a liar (they say they didn't use the stolen animations, but since Stroker says they were using them, they're lying when they say they weren't).

And of course pointing out the Emperor has no clothes gets nothing but scorn and derision from the high-and-mighty Stroker, since he's a Big Name Content creator and I'm a nobody.

My feelings on that:

This is exactly why my forum post count will never reach the thousands. People misconstrue and contort your words to fit their own agenda. I am sorry you are so bitter Sol. But I can assure you the people in THIS forum know me and have for years. Your resentment will fall on deaf ears here.

Speaking of resentments..Know why resentments are like peeing in your pants? Everyone else can see it. but youre the only one who feels it.

Cel Edman · 06-17-2008, 07:54 PM

Most items from the person got blocked this weekend Yay! Way to go Linden!!!!

Today I can unpack the boxes he sold full perms again, and give them to all my friends as well, still showing him as original creator! Including 'his' TOS....

Solomon Devoix · 06-17-2008, 07:57 PM

Stroker, first you claimed that every single case where the content was broken was because the scripts accompanied the illegal animations.

Then you spin that by saying we should have known you meant the majority of the cases, and it's only because of a lack of intonation in text that we didn't.

There's no lacking intonation to misunderstand the words "in every single case".

Show me how there is, and I'll drop it.

Otherwise... friends sticking up for you, etc.... well, that's fine. I can only judge a man by his actions and his words.

Oh, yeah... another reason I'm "bitter" as you put it?

I said all along the real problem with how LL handled this was that legitimate users of the scripts got their stuff nuked. And you said that I could "keep clinging to the belief" that there WERE legitimate users of the script, who were not using the illegal animations, that got hurt.

Care to comment on THAT one and tell me why, due to lack of intonation, you didn't mean what you wrote there, either?

/me waits.

**Stroker Serpentine** · 06-17-2008, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cel Ed

Most items from the person got blocked this weekend Yay! Way to go Linden!!!!

Today I can unpack the boxes he sold full perms again, and give them to all my friends as well, still showing him as original creator! Including 'his' TOS....

Welcome to SLU Cel

I know you were affected considerably by the actions of Pascal/Solo/Eva.

I'm sure this is a hollow victory for you. :-/

Wildefire Walcott · 06-17-2008, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cel Ed

Most items from the person got blocked this weekend Yay! Way to go Linden!!!!

Today I can unpack the boxes he sold full perms again, and give them to all my friends as well, still showing him as original creator! Including 'his' TOS....

Hah, wow, what a cock that guy is/was.

Aminom Marvin · 06-17-2008, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stroker Serpentine

Okay, I am going to rant my ass off here...I am sure everyone has seen the blog post by now where the content that was "apparently" removed over the weekend has since been restored.

I KNEW it was too good to be true that LL actually GREW SOME BALLS and targeted KNOWN content thieves whom have been AR'd and DMCA'd on numerous occasions and CONTINUE to pop back on the grid with the same content and a different account.

The official forums were ablaze with everything from "ZOMG..my sexbed is broke" to "I was wondering why LL chose now to act upon this..I have been complaining for months" Someone IM Craig Altman or Johan Durant and ask them if they intended for their animations to be included full perm in the BIB's and sexbeds blanketing the grid. The very ones that were obviously the target of this takedown. The ones I have been fighting because they were named "Sexgen insert"

Ask Craig about how confused he was when LL actually banned someone (so he thought) for being a thief. Ooops..they just put the content right back up. Sorrrry our bad! Inadvertent mistake!
Ask me why Rase Kenzo and Volkov Catteneo still have active accounts when they ADMITTED to stealing IP in a COURT ORDER!

I will tell you why if by now you may be a bit confused. It is all summed up and tucked nice and cozy into this blog today...

"Also be aware that persons who materially misrepresent copyright infringement in DMCA claims may be liable for damages, including attorneys’ fees and costs. In one case, a company that sought removal of content protected by the fair use doctrine paid over $100,000 USD. For more on this, see here."

The Diebold case is one of DMCA abuse. So lets send a message to all the residents of SL LaurapLinden that you could be SUED if you file a DMCA. For 100's of thousands of dollars no less!

Linden Lab does not give a rats ass about your content. Its all Fair Use people! How DARE they placate us like this. I am sooo PISSED.
Joshua, I hope you are reading this because you have won me over. The only way Linden Lab will ever protect your IP is if they are made to do so with a big fat class action suit.

I cant even type I am so mad. I wish they would just come out and say it...oh wait, they would be liable then. Duh!

Quoted for truth.

Here's a precisely similar case that shows exactly how LL is not following the law:

Let's say that Hosting Company X has piratedfile.mpg on their servers. A DMCA is filed requesting piratedfile.mpg be taken down. Instead of taking it down, they simply remove all links to the file. However, the file is still accessible.

Would this fly? Hell no. And by refusing to take down the content and only specific references to it (IE objects in world or in inventory) they are doing EXACTLY the same thing.

So, LL is opening themselves to a world of legal hurt. It isn't a matter of if, but a matter of when a case related to this is taken to court and LL is listed at one of the defendants. And THEY WILL LOOSE.

Of course, they could actually grow a pair (as well as a brain) and actually do AT LEAST what is minimally required to follow the law, or preferably be more pro-active in protecting IP rights. However they won't, because they have been shown to have a corporate culture with a disdain for IP rights. This has been showing both indirectly by their actions and DIRECTLY by what the Lindens have said during office hours (that there is a "controversy" over IP right issues and linking to anti-IP right articles.)

This disdain isn't just found in LL; it is common among computer technologist circles. Partly it is the result of draconian tactics from the RIAA and MPAA, but just because some corporations try to abuse the system as much as possible doesn't mean it should be thrown out entirely.

Atashi Yue · 06-17-2008, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cel Ed

Most items from the person got blocked this weekend Yay! Way to go Linden!!!!

Today I can unpack the boxes he sold full perms again, and give them to all my friends as well, still showing him as original creator! Including 'his' TOS....

Wow. No shame at all!

Ten · 06-17-2008, 08:08 PM

LL has no spine. They're more interested in being popular than carrying out proper DMCA procedure.

This is disgusting.

**Stroker Serpentine** · 06-17-2008, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solomon Devoix

Stroker, first you claimed that every single case where the content was broken was because the scripts accompanied the illegal animations.

Then you spin that by saying we should have known you meant the majority of the cases, and it's only because of a lack of intonation in text that we didn't.

There's no lacking intonation to misunderstand the words "in every single case".

Show me how there is, and I'll drop it.

Otherwise... friends sticking up for you, etc.... well, that's fine. I can only judge a man by his actions and his words.

Oh, yeah... another reason I'm "bitter" as you put it?

I said all along the real problem with how LL handled this was that legitimate users of the scripts got their stuff nuked. And you said that I could "keep clinging to the belief" that there WERE legitimate users of the script, who were not using the illegal animations, that got hurt.

Care to comment on THAT one and tell me why, due to lack of intonation, you didn't mean what you wrote there, either?

/me waits.

What scripts did I mention? Are they the ones you used? Did you have anything borked? Do you know anyone PERSONALLY who did?
What scripts were they using? Were they using the scripts that were in the item I was referring to? Do you know that for sure? Do you even have a vested interest in this issue, other than your opinion? CONTEXT..use it or lose it.

Sansarya · 06-17-2008, 08:12 PM

My rather confused summary: Linden Lab removed content belonging to Eva & Loni, but it was the wrong content because they only removed the OS script and not the stolen animations, and now they've restored the script and people got their stuff back, but it came back broken...and people still have stolen animations in their inventories?

Is ALL the content that was removed now returned? Do the fake Sexgen beds work now? Anyone know? (I'd test it myself but I bought the real SexGen 3 yrs ago, not a fake...)

Kesseret · 06-17-2008, 08:14 PM

I honestly am so disgusted at LL I don't even know what to say. *spit*

Solomon Devoix · 06-17-2008, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stroker Serpentine

What scripts did I mention? Are they the ones you used? Did you have anything borked? Do you know anyone PERSONALLY who did?
What scripts were they using? Were they using the scripts that were in the item I was referring to? Do you know that for sure? Do you even have a vested interest in this issue, other than your opinion? CONTEXT..use it or lose it.

Well, let's see...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stroker Serpentine

Go to SLX and/or OnRez and search “sexbed”. 80% of those products use Eva C’s freebie anim engine with stolen/unlicensed animations. Some are sold full perm.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solomon Devoix

Many of the scripts that were removed were LEGITIMATE scripts, which happened to have Eva listed as the script creator, but were in no way infringing.

So explain to me how removing LEGITIMATE and VALID and NON-INFRINGING content is breaking “bad” eggs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stroker Serpentine

You can cling to this if you like, as many have. But everyone conviently leaves out the part about the STOLEN animations that were included in every single one of these “broken items” along with the scripts.

LL removed all items with Eva listed as the creator
All in-world items that used the perfectly legitimate MLP script that showed Eva as the creator stopped working because of the script being removed
YOU mention the Eva-as-creator animation scripts
I mention the non-infringing, legitimate scripts being removed
You say that every single one of the broken items included the stolen animations

Yes, I personally know someone (furniture store occupying 2/3 of a sim) whose content was broken when LL removed all the Eva-as-creator scripts. And they were NOT using any of the stolen animations.

Ball's in your court.

Ten · 06-17-2008, 08:23 PM

Anyone up for a class action lawsuit?

**Stroker Serpentine** · 06-17-2008, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wildefire Walcott

Hah, wow, what a cock that guy is/was.

I dont think Cel was directing his anger at anyone in particular. His cynacism is well earned. He wrote Sculptypaint and had just about everything he ever made stolen by this Pascal/Eva/Loni character and resold with his own TOS.

I think what he was saying Wilde is that he can now give away the content since it is useless.

**Stroker Serpentine** · 06-17-2008, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solomon Devoix

Well, let's see...

LL removed all items with Eva listed as the creator
All in-world items that used the perfectly legitimate MLP script that showed Eva as the creator stopped working because of the script being removed
YOU mention the Eva-as-creator animation scripts
I mention the non-infringing, legitimate scripts being removed
You say that every single one of the broken items included the stolen animations

Yes, I personally know someone (furniture store occupying 2/3 of a sim) whose content was broken when LL removed all the Eva-as-creator scripts. And they were NOT using any of the stolen animations.

Ball's in your court.

/me gives Sol a cookie

Macphisto Angelus · 06-17-2008, 08:42 PM

LauraPLinden responds to various questions.. by not really clearing anything up.

Quote:

@14, 17, 33 — Yes, to clarify, our mistake was that we removed content that was not the subject of a DMCA notification. We’ve taken steps to make sure this doesn’t happen again. And we apologize for this mistake and for the confusion it caused.
@ 28, 35 — We agree that it’s not good practice to remove content from Residents’ inworld and inventory locations without notifying them. That’s not our DMCA policy or practice. Our practice is to send email to the email address we have on file for the owners of the content that’s to be removed. So it shouldn’t be a surprise when content disappears as the result of a DMCA claim. The disappearance of content this past weekend without notice was our mistake. It’s not our DMCA policy or practice. Again, we’re sorry about its happening and have implemented internal processes to protect against its happening again.
@54 — If your content was subject to a DMCA notification sent to Linden Lab, we would have sent you email to your email address on file for your account. Check that email address. You may also send questions about your content and the DMCA process to removals@lindenlab.com.
@65 — Questions about the status of DMCA claims submitted to us may be sent to removals@lindenlab.com. You might check whether these creators submitted claims as abuse reports or through the DMCA process outlined here: Second Life | DMCA: Digital Millennium Copyright Act. DMCA claims must be submitted through the DMCA process (and not as abuse reports).
@2 — This information is not intended to scare Residents. As we know well from our mistake this past weekend, content removal is a serious matter. It’s an extremely important tool for copyright owners to remedy infringement. But before proceeding, it’s important to understand any competing rights and interests. The different viewpoints in the comments to this blog post show well that there are interests on all sides of content removal. Thanks, everyone, for contributing your thoughts.

Hypatia Callisto · 06-17-2008, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stroker Serpentine

What scripts did I mention? Are they the ones you used? Did you have anything borked? Do you know anyone PERSONALLY who did?
What scripts were they using? Were they using the scripts that were in the item I was referring to? Do you know that for sure? Do you even have a vested interest in this issue, other than your opinion? CONTEXT..use it or lose it.

http://uncensored.slexchange.com/mod...&ItemID=692115

That was also affected and is a completely legal dollarbie.

There were a few people who said in the forums that the modded scripts from Lear Jeff were also not working, they had Eva Capalini as creator but as far as I know, not the animations. Isablan Neva being one who reported this - I would consider her to be a reputable source.

but this is beside the point - the real issue is that the DMCA doesn't say to delete all the content - it specifically says that the content under dispute should be removed. LL obviously borked this one BIG TIME.

Content that should be gone is still freely available and content that should have never been touched is borked to hell. It's just unimaginably bad for everyone all the way around.

My MLP script mods all work without issues - but I had my MLP 1.2 scripts originally from Miffy Fluff, and yep, all those original scripts work fine too. the MLP didnt come with any illegal content, at least the one I have directly from Miffy Fluffy doesn't.

I regularly copypaste open source stuff into new scripts now, as well as store them offline in case of database hiccups, so nothing of mine was affected. (I use my "pg mod" of MLP in a product of mine - this product is absolutely unaffected and uses animations I created myself in Poser. Textures are mods of ones for sale on DAZ3d and this product can also be bought on DAZ Island

*end commercial grin*)

Solomon Devoix · 06-17-2008, 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stroker Serpentine

/me gives Sol a cookie

/me notices you dodged actually giving an answer. As I said, I am quite willing to drop it, if you'll tell me how "every single one of the "broken items" " really meant "the majority of the items".

Dnate Mars · 06-17-2008, 08:48 PM

Tear it all down and start again, it is the only way.

Joshua Nightshade · 06-17-2008, 08:51 PM

Solomon please drop it.

**Io Zeno** · 06-17-2008, 08:53 PM

I'm tired and I don't feel well and still don't understand any of this but have no doubt that I am outraged anyway.

Solomon Devoix · 06-17-2008, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshua Nightshade

Solomon please drop it.

Will do.

As Joshua pointed out to me, it's derailing the thread from the main travesty: LL not removing most of the actual infringing content, then restoring what little of the infringing content they managed to remove.

And I also agree -- as I always have -- that any content creator is right to be outraged when their stuff is stolen, and further outraged when LL doesn't do anything about it, or does it in such a useless, brain-damaged fashion as this.

I'm a content creator as well, so it would be idiotic of me not to support creators' IP. I'm just a little guy, though, and so far as I know, none of my stuff has been ripped. Doesn't mean that I won't support the rights of those that have had their stuff ripped, though; I do.

Hypatia Callisto · 06-17-2008, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stroker Serpentine

I dont think Cel was directing his anger at anyone in particular. His cynacism is well earned. He wrote Sculptypaint and had just about everything he ever made stolen by this Pascal/Eva/Loni character and resold with his own TOS.

I think what he was saying Wilde is that he can now give away the content since it is useless.

No, he's saying that he can rez it again and it's available inworld as before. :/ Whereas on the weekend it was unable to be rezzed or transferred to anyone else.

Ten · 06-17-2008, 09:17 PM

No? Bueller? Bueller?

06-17-2008, 07:50 PM	#26 (permalink)
sezmra boosh! dweebalicious Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: TN, USA Posts: 227 My Mood: SLShopper Ads: 1 SL Join Date: July, 2004 Business: sezmra.com	Sigh. I never wanted to be one of those people who pull the "I'M NOT GOING TO CREATE ANY NEW XYZ UNTIL LL FIXES THIS!!!" card. Nope. I think it's just time to retire all together. __________________ "So what's this now, some kind of calm before the weird berserker storm?" -{@}- DJ Sezmra w/The Tempest - RadioRadio - Tuesdays 7pm

06-17-2008, 07:57 PM	#29 (permalink)
Solomon Devoix Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 56	Stroker, first you claimed that every single case where the content was broken was because the scripts accompanied the illegal animations. Then you spin that by saying we should have known you meant the majority of the cases, and it's only because of a lack of intonation in text that we didn't. There's no lacking intonation to misunderstand the words "in every single case". Show me how there is, and I'll drop it. Otherwise... friends sticking up for you, etc.... well, that's fine. I can only judge a man by his actions and his words. Oh, yeah... another reason I'm "bitter" as you put it? I said all along the real problem with how LL handled this was that legitimate users of the scripts got their stuff nuked. And you said that I could "keep clinging to the belief" that there WERE legitimate users of the script, who were not using the illegal animations, that got hurt. Care to comment on THAT one and tell me why, due to lack of intonation, you didn't mean what you wrote there, either? /me waits. __________________ I'm feeling fairly chipper despite some of the things going wrong in my life. It must be my meds.

06-17-2008, 08:08 PM	#34 (permalink)
Ten Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 6,918 My Mood: SL Join Date: 10/7/2006 Awards: 1	LL has no spine. They're more interested in being popular than carrying out proper DMCA procedure. This is disgusting. __________________ Shopping Cart Disco http://www.shoppingcartdisco.com THE BEATINGS WILL CONTINUE UNTIL MORALE IMPROVES.

06-17-2008, 08:14 PM	#37 (permalink)
Kesseret I has flavor. Meerkatting Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 223 My Mood: SLShopper Ads: 8 Business: KessKreations	I honestly am so disgusted at LL I don't even know what to say. spit __________________ KessKreations - Jewelry and Wedding Accessories I am pro cats, , , - drama, and .

06-17-2008, 08:48 PM	#45 (permalink)
Dnate Mars Tastes like purple Illyngophiliac Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Home Posts: 10,885 My Mood: Wordtris Champion! SL Join Date: 01/27/2004 Business: Scripter for hire XBOX Leaderboard: 37^th	Tear it all down and start again, it is the only way. __________________ SLU Clubhouse - Open 24/7 Visit at http://slurl.com/secondlife/Tan/138/25/25

06-17-2008, 07:54 PM	#28 (permalink)
Cel Edman Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Amsterdam Posts: 13 SL Join Date: may 2007	Most items from the person got blocked this weekend Yay! Way to go Linden!!!! Today I can unpack the boxes he sold full perms again, and give them to all my friends as well, still showing him as original creator! Including 'his' TOS....

06-17-2008, 08:12 PM	#36 (permalink)
Sansarya Koo Koo Kachoo! Feeling Octoberish Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Rosebud Posts: 1,516 My Mood: SL Join Date: April 2005 Blog Entries: 2	My rather confused summary: Linden Lab removed content belonging to Eva & Loni, but it was the wrong content because they only removed the OS script and not the stolen animations, and now they've restored the script and people got their stuff back, but it came back broken...and people still have stolen animations in their inventories? Is ALL the content that was removed now returned? Do the fake Sexgen beds work now? Anyone know? (I'd test it myself but I bought the real SexGen 3 yrs ago, not a fake...)

06-17-2008, 08:23 PM	#39 (permalink)
Ten Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 6,918 My Mood: SL Join Date: 10/7/2006 Awards: 1	Anyone up for a class action lawsuit?

06-17-2008, 08:51 PM	#46 (permalink)
Joshua Nightshade Account Closed Unedited Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 33,567 My Mood:	Solomon please drop it.

06-17-2008, 08:53 PM	#47 (permalink)
Io Zeno Gone SLU Supporter Stoking the fires of Hell Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: New York City Posts: 17,021 My Mood: Blog Entries: 1 Awards: 1	I'm tired and I don't feel well and still don't understand any of this but have no doubt that I am outraged anyway.

06-17-2008, 09:17 PM	#50 (permalink)
Ten Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 6,918 My Mood: SL Join Date: 10/7/2006 Awards: 1	No? Bueller? Bueller?

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