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**Eunoli Rain** · 07-14-2012, 01:43 PM

Ok. I'm stupid enough to be contemplating opening a new sim - yet again. But, I'm thinking if I do it I may attempt an all mesh build.

So, question for you performance geeks: can people's viewers -handle- an all mesh build plus 30 or 40 avatars? Do the same issues with texture size apply in larger mesh structures? Does SL note repeating textures in mesh? Would a series of mesh trees and bushes using the same texture be seen as all identical for caching?

Thoughts, ideas and such appreciated.

pancake · 07-14-2012, 02:45 PM

Have you visited or talked to the people at the new all mesh Hogwarts RP sim?

There is a write up here.

Quan's Travelogues: Hogwarts in Mesh

It was full OOC for tours until yesterday I think, though I'm sure you can still pop in. The owners might have some interesting insight to your questions.

pancake · 07-14-2012, 03:44 PM

I also went to see one of the GE sims, Skerry of Einar or something like that, when I heard they went almost all mesh.

When I was visiting there was a full meter combat raid going on, at least 30 avies, and I didn't find the lag to be any worse, and perhaps even a bit better, than it normally would be in those types of raids.

If a heavy meter combat sim chose to go all mesh, I suspect they must have found there was a performance bonus to doing so but I can't say for sure.

**Eunoli Rain** · 07-14-2012, 03:50 PM

I'm guessing there's probably a bonus. You use less prims..less for the server to have to parse through - plus it looks better. But, I'm also wondering what considerations I'm missing. Those two posts are very helpful, Pancake. Thanks.

Ramen Jedburgh · 07-15-2012, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pancake

I also went to see one of the GE sims, Skerry of Einar or something like that, when I heard they went almost all mesh.

When I was visiting there was a full meter combat raid going on, at least 30 avies, and I didn't find the lag to be any worse, and perhaps even a bit better, than it normally would be in those types of raids.

If a heavy meter combat sim chose to go all mesh, I suspect they must have found there was a performance bonus to doing so but I can't say for sure.

I would think using all mesh in a combat sim would be a terrible idea. You could log in on a viewer that doesn't support mesh and basocally see through all of the cover.

Or at least that is hiw it seems like it would work on my SimonaStick. If I use the included Imprudence viewer, all my mesh uploads look like ugly pancakes. If I log in with Firestorm, they look like things.

**Joshua Nightshade** · 07-15-2012, 10:39 AM

Or use a third party viewer and just derender geometry like what people do to find hunt items?

Ramen Jedburgh · 07-15-2012, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshua Nightshade

Or use a third party viewer and just derender geometry like what people do to find hunt items?

Bah, item hunts are done with a viewer that has an area search function.

**Eunoli Rain** · 07-15-2012, 11:09 AM

If I do another sim, it will not be a combat sim.

Liandra Hellershanks · 07-16-2012, 02:17 AM

Hiya, Eunoli!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eunoli Rain

Do the same issues with texture size apply in larger mesh structures? Does SL note repeating textures in mesh? Would a series of mesh trees and bushes using the same texture be seen as all identical for caching?

As far as I know, textures applied to mesh are handled exactly the same as textures intended to be applied to anything else. And yes, if you set up the UV map properly, mesh can handle repeating textures, just like prims.

Johnnytreadlightly Nightfire · 07-16-2012, 02:44 AM

If you have a good mesh builder, I'd recommend it. That Hogwarts region is extremely well done! If someone had to do something like that in sculpts and prims I imagine graphical performance would be far worse.

I've been slowly replacing my prim builds on my 1/4 mainland with mesh, and the LI savings has been awesome. Rendering is super fast too. But I'm also reusing textures, and have smaller mesh buildings. As someone mentioned, I think the biggest challenge you'll have to overcome would be people on older viewers (there's not that many) who aren't able to see it.

Da5id Abbot · 07-16-2012, 03:55 AM

You might want to catch up with Vic Mornington from the Dr Who Expo (Eutopia sim, but he posts here) as well, since a lot of that sim has been mesh for a while now. I've certainly not had any problems going to events there.

Adeon Writer · 07-16-2012, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramen Jedburgh

Bah, item hunts are done with a viewer that has an area search function.

The smart ones use unpredictable names; although if they have unique textures then there's that.

Charlemagne Allen · 07-16-2012, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pancake

I also went to see one of the GE sims, Skerry of Einar or something like that, when I heard they went almost all mesh.

When I was visiting there was a full meter combat raid going on, at least 30 avies, and I didn't find the lag to be any worse, and perhaps even a bit better, than it normally would be in those types of raids.

If a heavy meter combat sim chose to go all mesh, I suspect they must have found there was a performance bonus to doing so but I can't say for sure.

Olds AFB has a nice full-mesh aircraft carrier and it seems to work great for less prims.

Also, I recently changed my skybox to an all mesh build, and it's quite lovely while being very low lag.

Fluffy · 07-16-2012, 10:10 AM

Having recently tried building some very large scale builds using mesh I'd definitely recommend it, although I'd try and avoid using large single mesh objects in favour of things created from smaller mesh components, since the land impact seems to work in favour of the latter and punishes the former quite heavily.

At the risk of shameless self-promotion (and repetition, since I already posted pictures of it in the Show us your Sculpties/Meshes thread), here's a couple of snapshots of the largest of my "experiments".

Feel free to drop by and take a look at it up close (sim name is Fluffyland), while it's quite repetitive due to being comprised of only a few individual components, it's a reasonable example of the kind of detail that can be achieved using mesh. I'm sure that other creators with far more artistic talent than myself will eventually be creating mesh enviroments that will outshine the majority of existing SL content.

Ramen Jedburgh · 07-16-2012, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adeon Writer

The smart ones use unpredictable names; although if they have unique textures then there's that.

One store I like to hunt from would name random objects the same as the hunt item. Walls and decorations. When you did a search you would get like 20 entries.

**Eunoli Rain** · 07-16-2012, 12:06 PM

If I do this (and its looking more and more like I'm going to be suckered back into the black hole of sim ownership again), it will be a modern urban build - but I don't want to look like every generic modern urban build out there - I think a mesh build will offer the option to make it more interesting/unique.

I'd love to use the builder I used for Thinis - but she's really expensive and I am hoping not to dump massive amounts of money this time. That said, as much as I'd like to think I could get a copy of Maya and become ultra mesh builder in 30 minutes, I'm aware that is about as likely to happen as my becoming a triathlon champion in the same amount of time.

Does anyone know if there's a mesh builder's group where people are going to hire builders? I'm not at all opposed to paying a fair price and am pretty easy to work with (though very picky about quality) - I just can't afford the thousands I paid the last time around.

Ramen Jedburgh · 07-16-2012, 12:21 PM

My suggestion would be to use SimOnAStick to prototype to save upload costs.

http://simonastick.com/

It is extremely easy to use. You will need to use something besides the included Imprudence Viewer to see and use Mesh though.

07-14-2012, 01:43 PM	#1 (permalink)
Eunoli Rain Senior Member *SLU Supporter* Not eating peas Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Shady Falls Posts: 2,025	All mesh sim build? Ok. I'm stupid enough to be contemplating opening a new sim - yet again. But, I'm thinking if I do it I may attempt an all mesh build. So, question for you performance geeks: can people's viewers -handle- an all mesh build plus 30 or 40 avatars? Do the same issues with texture size apply in larger mesh structures? Does SL note repeating textures in mesh? Would a series of mesh trees and bushes using the same texture be seen as all identical for caching? Thoughts, ideas and such appreciated.

07-14-2012, 02:45 PM	#2 (permalink)
pancake SLU Fluffer Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: The True North Posts: 3,437 My Mood: SL Join Date: 2007 Client: Usually Catznip but I dabble a lot in others Awards: 1	Have you visited or talked to the people at the new all mesh Hogwarts RP sim? There is a write up here. Quan's Travelogues: Hogwarts in Mesh It was full OOC for tours until yesterday I think, though I'm sure you can still pop in. The owners might have some interesting insight to your questions. __________________ My blog and my pictures "It's one thing to have a difference of opinion, it is quite another to be a consistently toxic ass" ~ Cristiano

07-16-2012, 03:55 AM	#11 (permalink)
Da5id Abbot Bigger on the inside Have time, will travel. Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: UK Posts: 632 My Mood: SL Join Date: 28th March 2010 Client: Dolphin & Niran's	You might want to catch up with Vic Mornington from the Dr Who Expo (Eutopia sim, but he posts here) as well, since a lot of that sim has been mesh for a while now. I've certainly not had any problems going to events there. __________________ "I learned long ago never to wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and, besides, the pig likes it." - George Bernard Shaw

07-16-2012, 10:10 AM	#14 (permalink)
Fluffy Sharkfin Fantabulous Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 99 My Mood: SL Join Date: Dec 2004 Client: V3	Having recently tried building some very large scale builds using mesh I'd definitely recommend it, although I'd try and avoid using large single mesh objects in favour of things created from smaller mesh components, since the land impact seems to work in favour of the latter and punishes the former quite heavily. At the risk of shameless self-promotion (and repetition, since I already posted pictures of it in the Show us your Sculpties/Meshes thread), here's a couple of snapshots of the largest of my "experiments". Feel free to drop by and take a look at it up close (sim name is Fluffyland), while it's quite repetitive due to being comprised of only a few individual components, it's a reasonable example of the kind of detail that can be achieved using mesh. I'm sure that other creators with far more artistic talent than myself will eventually be creating mesh enviroments that will outshine the majority of existing SL content. __________________

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07-14-2012, 03:44 PM	#3 (permalink)
pancake SLU Fluffer Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: The True North Posts: 3,437 My Mood: SL Join Date: 2007 Client: Usually Catznip but I dabble a lot in others Awards: 1	I also went to see one of the GE sims, Skerry of Einar or something like that, when I heard they went almost all mesh. When I was visiting there was a full meter combat raid going on, at least 30 avies, and I didn't find the lag to be any worse, and perhaps even a bit better, than it normally would be in those types of raids. If a heavy meter combat sim chose to go all mesh, I suspect they must have found there was a performance bonus to doing so but I can't say for sure.

07-14-2012, 03:50 PM	#4 (permalink)
Eunoli Rain Senior Member *SLU Supporter* Not eating peas Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Shady Falls Posts: 2,025	I'm guessing there's probably a bonus. You use less prims..less for the server to have to parse through - plus it looks better. But, I'm also wondering what considerations I'm missing. Those two posts are very helpful, Pancake. Thanks.

07-15-2012, 11:09 AM	#8 (permalink)
Eunoli Rain Senior Member *SLU Supporter* Not eating peas Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Shady Falls Posts: 2,025	If I do another sim, it will not be a combat sim.

07-16-2012, 02:44 AM	#10 (permalink)
Johnnytreadlightly Nightfire Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 520 My Mood:	If you have a good mesh builder, I'd recommend it. That Hogwarts region is extremely well done! If someone had to do something like that in sculpts and prims I imagine graphical performance would be far worse. I've been slowly replacing my prim builds on my 1/4 mainland with mesh, and the LI savings has been awesome. Rendering is super fast too. But I'm also reusing textures, and have smaller mesh buildings. As someone mentioned, I think the biggest challenge you'll have to overcome would be people on older viewers (there's not that many) who aren't able to see it.

07-16-2012, 12:06 PM	#16 (permalink)
Eunoli Rain Senior Member *SLU Supporter* Not eating peas Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Shady Falls Posts: 2,025	If I do this (and its looking more and more like I'm going to be suckered back into the black hole of sim ownership again), it will be a modern urban build - but I don't want to look like every generic modern urban build out there - I think a mesh build will offer the option to make it more interesting/unique. I'd love to use the builder I used for Thinis - but she's really expensive and I am hoping not to dump massive amounts of money this time. That said, as much as I'd like to think I could get a copy of Maya and become ultra mesh builder in 30 minutes, I'm aware that is about as likely to happen as my becoming a triathlon champion in the same amount of time. Does anyone know if there's a mesh builder's group where people are going to hire builders? I'm not at all opposed to paying a fair price and am pretty easy to work with (though very picky about quality) - I just can't afford the thousands I paid the last time around.

07-16-2012, 12:21 PM	#17 (permalink)
Ramen Jedburgh Ginger Supremacist Heya ^_^ Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Illinois, USA Posts: 1,849 My Mood: SL Join Date: 3/9/2006	My suggestion would be to use SimOnAStick to prototype to save upload costs. http://simonastick.com/ It is extremely easy to use. You will need to use something besides the included Imprudence Viewer to see and use Mesh though.

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