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Old 07-16-2015, 04:20 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Arrow Viewer-Managed Marketplace Released: Migration Begins July 23, 2015

The Viewer-Managed Marketplace (VMM) Viewer is now a release candidate, and automated migrations will begin on July 23, 2015. Migrations will be done weeknights between 9:00 PM and 9:00 AM Pacific. Merchants with large stores (over around 5,000 listings) will be scheduled, and we will send an email (to the email address associated with your store) to provide you with advance notice.

For all Merchants, we will send an email at the beginning of the migration process, and another email once it has completed. Merchants will not be able to modify items in their stores during this time, but purchases will continue for any item that is not in the process of being migrated.

Once your store is migrated, you’ll need to use the Second Life VMM Viewer to manage the inventory in your Marketplace store. The VMM knowledge base article has been translated to all six supported Marketplace languages and will help you get up to speed on VMM.

If you experience any problems after your migration has completed, please file a support ticket under Marketplace Item Listing Issues.

In order to learn about VMM before migration starts, you can watch tutorials on our Official Second Life YouTube Channel. Start with Second Life Viewer-Managed Marketplace: Pt. 1 - Learning Listing, Version & Stock Folders.







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Old 07-16-2015, 04:32 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Old 07-16-2015, 04:47 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Old 07-16-2015, 05:20 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Delightful. I wonder how much stuff will be broken this time.

And I hope to God Firestorm updates its viewer so I don't have to deal with the LL viewer for this malarkey.
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Old 07-16-2015, 06:34 PM   #5 (permalink)
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At least they're doing it during summer time, when sales are slow.
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Old 07-17-2015, 07:46 AM   #6 (permalink)
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We were expecting at least a few weeks from the time LL releases VMM to when they killed off merchant outboxes. For LL to do this, as announced... knowing the most used viewer cannot possibly have an update out in time is just a bone head move and frankly... just pisses me off.

We can't even begin merging VMM code into firestorm until it's released, (as per LL rules!) let alone stabilize it.
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Old 07-17-2015, 08:46 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Jessica lyon View Post
We were expecting at least a few weeks from the time LL releases VMM to when they killed off merchant outboxes. For LL to do this, as announced... knowing the most used viewer cannot possibly have an update out in time is just a bone head move and frankly... just pisses me off.

We can't even begin merging VMM code into firestorm until it's released, (as per LL rules!) let alone stabilize it.

*insert long string of cursing here*

If they fuck this up (and come on, we all know they'll fuck this up, they've fucked every migration EVER), it's going to leave me with trying to fix SEVERAL thousand items over the span of about 12 stores. I'm going to go through the roof if on top of that, I have to use LL official to do it.
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Old 07-17-2015, 09:44 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Yeah I'm just going to go ahead and schedule a large block of time to deal with any fuckups.
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Old 07-17-2015, 10:09 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Fortunately I have only a few older products on MP so it's got a limited scope for migration screw-ups with my things. I held back on updating the store as soon as this crap was announced, so I'll just work on some product updates while the inevitable teething problems arise.

I'm guessing there won't be a side effect of old inactive stores vanishing from the MP if they are delivering from inventory?
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Old 07-17-2015, 10:26 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Yeah I'm just going to go ahead and schedule a large block of time to deal with any fuckups.
That block of time will be at least a month, given how bloated and slow the Marketplace can be.

I'm livid. I do NOT use the LL viewer because it's ungainly and awful. And now it's a certainty Firestorm won't have an update for a while because of LL's stupid viewer rules.

Gah. I only have the one store, but it's going to take weeks to sort out all the stupid.
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Old 07-17-2015, 10:32 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Does this mean anything for consumers and how we use the MP? Or only merchants?
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Old 07-17-2015, 10:55 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Does this mean anything for consumers and how we use the MP? Or only merchants?
There will be no difference at all for customers.
The differences for merchants are also minor.

VMM uses a "different merchant outbox" where the contents will be visible in our inventories, it introduces better ways to replace items with new versions, and more of the listing process can be done within the (LL for now) viewer.
We can still do everything from the website as before, though.
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Old 07-17-2015, 11:03 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Does this mean anything for consumers and how we use the MP? Or only merchants?
Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!

(i.e., pretty much business as usual.)
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Old 07-17-2015, 11:21 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Anyone else see Oz here before peepin this thread?
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Old 07-17-2015, 11:24 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Old 07-17-2015, 11:29 AM   #16 (permalink)
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I've been wondering whether to close my store. This may do it for me, without a decision being required.
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Old 07-17-2015, 11:32 AM   #17 (permalink)
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I'll gladly eat crow if my fears are proven wrong, and this is a smooth process.

But I still hate the LL viewer. It makes my avatar look weird. And I can't find all the things I'm used to having in the firestorm viewer. Like usability.
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Old 07-17-2015, 11:51 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Old 07-17-2015, 12:16 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I'll clarify, now that I'm a bit less livid...

We are actually in fact allowed to merge code before it is released, but not before it goes into Release Candidate and VMM is in RC right now. However for our own sanity we cannot sensibly merge code out of the order in which LL releases it. We also rarely know what order release candidates will be released in and since there are usually more than one RC on the go at any given time we generally have to wait until LL actually releases it before we can merge it to our working repository.

Once we have VMM merged we're going to go straight into release mode, cut a release branch and code freeze for all except blockers. We're going to really push for an intense QA cycle and I'm hoping we'll be able to issue a preview build to our preview group within 1 week from the time we get a beta out to our QA team. Merchants will be able to use that preview for VMM but the key word here is 'hoping'. there are no guarantees or promises that will happen and the reality is that there is still no chance we'll have that available before the 23rd either.

On the bright side... LL has done a LOT of work and testing with VMM and at least initially it looks very good. They seem to have done it well this time and the system, if it works as planned will be a very good system in the long run. I think Merchants will like it.
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Old 07-17-2015, 12:28 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Already manually converted a few accounts' MP stores to use this. It was not the most exciting way to spend time, but it was easy enough and nothing broke. To buyers, the changes really are completely invisible.
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Old 07-17-2015, 12:37 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Only a teeny MP merchant but been using it for any new stuff and - it was not much different from the Merchant Outbox in use. Always had copy in inv anyway so not a big change. As I use the LL viewer to check stuff anyway not a great wrench (no, can not build in it but different issue) as still can't work out the communication thingie. Not a big drag as its on for specific purposes. My only issue is the way stuff ends up being called (sub folders?) but that could be due to my own incompetence.
The hours stated though - thats 6 am to 6 pm (ach 12 hour clock) our side
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Old 07-17-2015, 04:12 PM   #22 (permalink)
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I have been using the VMM for a bit now with over 200 items in it. There were some growing pains and early issues and most seem to have been worked out. When I have a product ready, I load up the LL viewer, add the items to the VMM folder, log out and go back to Firestorm. Everything else is good from there on out.

Only downside is that I can't wear any of my clothes from the Marketplace folder as that will cause listing and perhaps delivery issues. So if I want to wear something of my own, I must make a copy of the MP folder and place it elsewhere in my inventory. If I did that for everything, then it would effectively double the size of my inventory.

That, however, raises a question. When they migrate my store, will I automatically get 800 new folders in my inventory with the contents of the MP listings? I hate to think how big my inventory will be now...
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Old 07-17-2015, 04:29 PM   #23 (permalink)
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That, however, raises a question. When they migrate my store, will I automatically get 800 new folders in my inventory with the contents of the MP listings? I hate to think how big my inventory will be now...
You'd probably be better off to ask that question here:

https://community.secondlife.com/t5/...3/td-p/2949606

and describe what you have and have not done to migrate your existing listings.

Inventory size isn't that much of an issue as long as you don't have too many (several thousand or more for most people) items in the same folder.
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Old 07-18-2015, 12:21 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Old 07-18-2015, 12:36 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Does this mean anything for consumers and how we use the MP? Or only merchants?
It might mean a delay in merchants adding new items to the MP for a while. Even if everything goes smoothly (and that's a big if) there is still the general fuckuppery of the MP interface to deal with. It'll take merchants some time to check out the integrity of their stores post-migration.
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