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Old 02-16-2012, 02:08 PM   #276 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kadah Coba View Post
I was merely confused and not insinuating anything. Initially I thought you meant PMs, it made sense in the context of the first post but I never heard the term "whisper" used in regards to SL for anything other than local, thus were my confusion started. Sorry if I seemed like I was trying to be insulting, I wasn't, I'm just not good with words.
Okie dokie. I do that sometimes. Depending on what I'm logged into, a user to user message is an IM, a whisper, a page, or something else, and I sometimes think I'm on x when I'm on y and say the other. I also tend to try to use /me in places where /me doesn't work (in which case I either get an error message farted out or I do something stupid and send a user message to "me"). Sorry about the brainfart.

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Originally Posted by Kadah Coba View Post
I've never seen the new message number for PMs on any of the accounts I tested back then, for me it would only show for the other forms of notification. Currently I do not know if those issues I saw were fixed, I don't get any activity on my web profile these days, I think the novelty wore off for everyone on my "friends" list.
Basically unless you're online at the very moment you get it, all it does is overlay a little orange circle over the envelope icon on the profile, with a number on the inside dictating how many notifications and messages you have. If you do anything at all involving the profile, feed, or someone else's, you're going to see it. It's pretty visible -- but won't be if you're not looking at the web profile / feed each use. I get them on occasion, usually from people inquiring about things in my teensy shop, and I've gotten plenty while away and was able to answer via my cellphone's web browser, and didn't have to worry about IM/object cap. That aspect of it is pretty nice.

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Originally Posted by Kadah Coba View Post
The first question should really be "Do you use FS or plan to in the future?" since it sorta maters what the intended audience would like to expect.
If it's on the login screen, wouldn't that pretty much already just be FS users? Or did you change your mind and would like to get input for all parties, including those merely interested in trying FS at a later time?

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Originally Posted by Kadah Coba View Post
It would have to worded in a way that favors 1:1 since LL has determined it as what they would like the standard to be, but I'm only guessing since they still haven't updated that to their Limits documentation. Currently it says it should be 1:0.99. Personally I would use the results from this (at the moment) fictional poll as a factor in any decision.
Keep in mind that I'm only speaking speculatively right now, I need to take this up with the rest of the team. Unlike other TPVs (like Emerald), a single person can't just add or change something important only because they wanted to.
Right, right. I pretty much agree with you.
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Old 02-16-2012, 02:30 PM   #277 (permalink)
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Because someone attached one of these to the thread?


Speaking of which, any developments on the attribution front?
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Old 02-16-2012, 02:40 PM   #278 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Mabb Dilweg View Post


Speaking of which, any developments on the attribution front?
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Originally Posted by Lord View Post
BTW, just to do some of that weaving Joshua was talking about...it appears that Zena Juran is now attributing the 'Features' of the Zen Viewer on its Wiki.








....Now back to the previously scheduled banter about 'Firestorm Devs' and who controls what goes into their viewer............................................ .................................................. ......
Not that it entirely matters, I'm pretty sure their reputation among SLU is shot to hell, and I don't think any of us are going to willingly recommend it to people we know who are curious.
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Old 02-16-2012, 03:17 PM   #279 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Inhandra View Post
I also tend to try to use /me in places where /me doesn't work (in which case I either get an error message farted out or I do something stupid and send a user message to "me").
You mean like in IMs and Local on v2/3 during the many times LL breaks it? :V


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Originally Posted by Inhandra View Post
If it's on the login screen, wouldn't that pretty much already just be FS users? Or did you change your mind and would like to get input for all parties, including those merely interested in trying FS at a later time?
The login page would just be one of the places it would be, if its done at all.
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Old 02-16-2012, 03:28 PM   #280 (permalink)
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You mean like in IMs and Local on v2/3 during the many times LL breaks it? :V
No, again I'm speaking of other platforms where I try to use SL commands and then come back to SL and try to use the other method.
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Old 02-16-2012, 03:36 PM   #281 (permalink)
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No, again I'm speaking of other platforms where I try to use SL commands and then come back to SL and try to use the other method.
I was joking.
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Old 02-16-2012, 03:37 PM   #282 (permalink)
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Old 02-16-2012, 04:03 PM   #283 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Kadah Coba View Post
I was referring to the people that have complained about them to me, but I have heard some people saying they like web profiles.
I love web profiles, love the social aspect too.

The problem I have is web in the viewer is unusable slow.

I wish the lab would just give us all the same data in XML or something, then it can be dressed up however we like and would be really exciting to see what TPV's did with the data.
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Old 02-16-2012, 05:03 PM   #284 (permalink)
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I wish the lab would just give us all the same data in XML or something, then it can be dressed up however we like and would be really exciting to see what TPV's did with the data.
So do we...but they're resisting it, strongly. We've been asking for an API, or a machine-processable version of the data, ever since web profiles came out. We had been talking about possibly scraping it, but decided that was too much of a moving target. The Lab wants us to show web profiles in the viewer as-is...slow, wasteful of screen real estate, and whatever else they may be.
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Old 02-16-2012, 05:10 PM   #285 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Tonya Souther View Post
So do we...but they're resisting it, strongly. We've been asking for an API, or a machine-processable version of the data, ever since web profiles came out. We had been talking about possibly scraping it, but decided that was too much of a moving target. The Lab wants us to show web profiles in the viewer as-is...slow, wasteful of screen real estate, and whatever else they may be.
The really stupid part I found is that some of the data is sent to the browser in java script wrapped JSON, so really its just a matter of them not wrapping the data and giving it a static URL structure.

You forgot to mention the frequent outages. All it takes is one of several differnt external providers or one of LL's many web systems to malfunction to take web profiles down.
If the legacy profiles API is down, you likely weren't able to login either.
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Old 02-17-2012, 10:42 PM   #286 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Kadah Coba View Post
Actually there are 3 official profile pictures aspect ratios. Thanks LL.
Here's a quick break down of them.

V1 aspects:
2nd life: about 4:3, 178133 pixels.
1st life: 1:1, 133133 pixels.
Picks: 16:9, 288162 pixels.
Classifieds: about 3:2, 206137 pixels.

V2 aspects:
2nd life: almost 1:1, 10099 pixels. (wtf?)
1st: life: about 4:3, V2: 124x102 pixels.
Picks: Thumbnail: 8:5, 8855 pixels. Expanded: about 5:3, 285172 pixels. (wtf?)
Classifieds: Thumbnail: 4:3, 6045 pixels. Expanded: about 4:3, 252188 pixels. Details: 17:7, 272112 pixels. (Seriously, wtf?)
FS aspects: same as above except,
2nd life: about 4:3, 220x180 pixels
1st life: 4:5, 275x225 pixels

Web profiles:
2nd life: Thumbnail: 1:1, 72x72 pixels. Zoomed: 1:1, 600x600 pixel image displayed as 300x300 pixels.
1nd life: Thumbnail: 1:1, 45x45 pixels. Zoomed: 1:1, 600x600 pixel image displayed as 300x300 pixels.
Picks: [At this point web profile went down with 500 errors (again) and I was unable to check, I will edit this post later after they are back up :/] Edit: Thumbnail: 4:3, 60x45 px. Zoomed: 4:3, 320x240 px.
Classifieds: There are not classifieds on web profiles, but you can see your own in the picks edit floater, which is the same as v2's.

Edit: So ok, LL introduced 2 or more new and completely different aspect ratios for each picture in your profile in the span of year and a half. How was that a good idea to change it every 18 months compared to trying to keep mostly constant with the old standard? o.O

According to what I've estimated, about 70% see the 1st life pick as 4:3.
After some further exploration on web profiles, I found that the aspect ratio on 1st and 2nd life pics is not constant. The thumbnail seems to always been resized to 1:1 (72x72 and 45x45), but the zoomed one does vary. I'm guessing this only happens when the pic was uploaded from web profiles, and that it is showing it as aspect. Obviously its still impossible to know what aspect ratio it is on those images since any image loading from SL assets is still limited to a 1:1 power of 2.
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Old 02-19-2012, 01:12 PM   #287 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Kadah Coba View Post
After some further exploration on web profiles, I found that the aspect ratio on 1st and 2nd life pics is not constant. The thumbnail seems to always been resized to 1:1 (72x72 and 45x45), but the zoomed one does vary. I'm guessing this only happens when the pic was uploaded from web profiles, and that it is showing it as aspect. Obviously its still impossible to know what aspect ratio it is on those images since any image loading from SL assets is still limited to a 1:1 power of 2.
I looked at this when I couldn't easily reply, and then forgot to come back and reply. Yes, the "real" image is shown when you zoom in on it. Only the preview is 1:1, which is why I was very insistent about being able to see the actual dimensions of one on it. You can have as weirdly sized pic as you want, just the general view of it is constrained. Assuming you're uploading via the web profile itself, which is preferable because then it's free.

Generally it's just easier to upload a large pic that's a square. No issues of it being squashed/stretched, and it can be zoomed for a closer look.
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Old 02-19-2012, 10:51 PM   #288 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Inhandra View Post
I looked at this when I couldn't easily reply, and then forgot to come back and reply. Yes, the "real" image is shown when you zoom in on it. Only the preview is 1:1, which is why I was very insistent about being able to see the actual dimensions of one on it. You can have as weirdly sized pic as you want, just the general view of it is constrained. Assuming you're uploading via the web profile itself, which is preferable because then it's free.

Generally it's just easier to upload a large pic that's a square. No issues of it being squashed/stretched, and it can be zoomed for a closer look.
During the dev meeting yesterday, someone pointed me to some random persons profile, and I'm gonna have to revise my notes again since this one was different. And since yesterday, this person's profile pic has changes and it displays in yet a different way. *sigh*

The "real" image was 350x600, the displayed size was 300x518. Not the same aspect between them which doesn't make much sense.
Today's image was 600386, and display as 300193. The asset texture for this profile's picture is 256x256, but I think all of them are uploaded from the web have that resolution.
BUT the really odd thing about today's pic is that its displayed 3 seperate times in zoomed.
(I've highlighted one of them in this snap)



I've done some experimenting with my own profile and have found the fallowing:
  1. The stored image on Amazon will be resized from the original to a max of 600px wide or tall. So if the image is really big in one direction, the other will be very small. Likewise, if the image is really small, it will be scaled up to 600px.
  2. The displayed image has a set width of 300px. Always. No exceptions. Not even if the original was smaller than 300px (it would have been scaled up to 600px in #1 anyway).
  3. The aspect between the original, stored, and displayed are typically all the same, but apparently in some rare cases its not.
  4. The web thumbnail will be resized to a along the shortest axis to 75px then cropped at the center at 75px on the other axis. (45x46 of "real world" pic)
  5. The legacy profile texture will be cropped in the same manner as the thumbnail, but to 256x256. In the case of a long or tall image, this texture can look really poor.
  6. When the pic is set from legacy profiles with a texture that not 1:1, like 1:2 512x256, it will be rescaled by the same rules as when uploaded from the web, but the legacy pic will not be affected in this case.
  7. 1.9MB pictures will cause an error even though it states the limit is 5MB, but they do actually upload and will not show for about a minute.
  8. Pictures upload from the web will show on legacy profiles almost instantly, but the opposite takes about a minute.
  9. The zoom js is apparently very slow to respond sometimes. This seems to be the cause of the triplicating.
  10. Web profiles love application errors. I've got a handful with in a few minutes of testing.
  11. Web profiles love 500 errors. I've gotten about a half dozen of the pink boxes during the last 15 minutes.
375x500 will be saved as 450x600 and displayed at 300x400.
460x3194 will be resized to 86x600, displayed at 300x2093, and look awful.
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Old 02-19-2012, 11:33 PM   #289 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Kadah Coba View Post
  • Web profiles love application errors. I've got a handful with in a few minutes of testing.
  • Web profiles love 500 errors. I've gotten about a half dozen of the pink boxes during the last 15 minutes.
Well, no wonder you don't like them, then. I don't get those problems at all, really. o_O
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Old 02-19-2012, 11:45 PM   #290 (permalink)
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Well, no wonder you don't like them, then. I don't get those problems at all, really. o_O
Well I don't like them mainly cause no one can change or improve how they are displayed, which is very large and slow. The server errors just make it an unreliable option, I've given up filling jiras on it, LL only manages to fix it for about 24 hours to a week at most each time.

Edit: Forgot to mention that I'm not the only one reporting seeing those issues frequently.

Last edited by Kadah Coba; 02-19-2012 at 11:52 PM.
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Old 02-20-2012, 07:46 AM   #291 (permalink)
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Well, no wonder you don't like them, then. I don't get those problems at all, really. o_O
I never had one error on it tbh and we both use our walls quite a bit.
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Old 02-20-2012, 08:14 AM   #292 (permalink)
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Old 02-20-2012, 08:43 PM   #293 (permalink)
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You must not be one the SL Illuminati, Kadah
I might have the kiss of death too, I swear nearly every high level Linden I've meet was gone several months later
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Old 03-03-2012, 08:52 AM   #294 (permalink)
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I downloaded and installed it. Seemed like a interesting client but it doesnt not have a grid selector so they are making this for SL only. Im not interested in clients / viewers that don't develop for the whole virtual world, and not just one grid.
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Old 03-03-2012, 07:10 PM   #295 (permalink)
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I downloaded and installed it. Seemed like a interesting client but it doesnt not have a grid selector so they are making this for SL only. Im not interested in clients / viewers that don't develop for the whole virtual world, and not just one grid.
Me/Preferences/Advanced/Show Grid Selection at Login

Probably worth looking through preferences options when first trying a new viewer.
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Old 03-04-2012, 03:05 AM   #296 (permalink)
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I downloaded and installed it.
I suggest you go change your password immediately.
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Old 03-04-2012, 03:06 PM   #297 (permalink)
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I suggest you go change your password immediately.
Why?
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Old 03-06-2012, 03:06 AM   #298 (permalink)
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probably because its logging your password
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Old 03-06-2012, 04:16 AM   #299 (permalink)
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probably because its logging your password
Excuse me? What basis in fact do you (or Shrug since I guess that's what he was also referring to) have for making such accusations?

I'm getting rather tired of the veiled accusations from various people about TPVs.

Present factual information that proves what you are saying, or stfu thank you very much.

Niran, I had a lot of respect for what you did and how helpful you were in the Kirsten's forums and I believe your viewer is fantastic, but making such statements, without backing it up with fact, in a thread dedicated to a competing viewer, comes across as disingenuous at best. It's certainly lowered my opinion of you as a person.

FYI I have no stake in this viewer. I dismissed it as an option for me long before it came to light that they had stuffed around with the attributions, but it's a long way from lack of attribution to illegal activity.

ETA: My sincere apologies to Niran - see below. Totally mistook his meaning. I take back what I said above!

Last edited by Mabb Dilweg; 03-06-2012 at 01:53 PM. Reason: I don't like ninja edits so I'll leave the original text for context.
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Old 03-06-2012, 06:24 AM   #300 (permalink)
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nonono you got me wrong , i was just saying what he was probably thinking , i personally dont care about that viewer and what it does i didnt mean to say that it really does log any passwords
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