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Old 01-11-2017, 09:07 AM   #276 (permalink)
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Does anyone know when Singularity will have an update to handle bento?

One of my friends is now wearing a bento head and it looks wonderfully freaky at the moment.
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Old 01-11-2017, 12:57 PM   #277 (permalink)
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Ded. It DED.

No seriously, its quite some time since i last heard from any of the Singu Devs and the Source Repository wasn't updated in 5 months either. Although i remember a faint mention that its secretly being worked on still by Liru. NO PROMISES.
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Old 01-12-2017, 01:22 AM   #278 (permalink)
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Check the latest Alpha "nightly" Build no. 6905 (it supposedly has had some Bento work done in it.) : Singularity Viewer Automated Build System
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Old 01-12-2017, 04:42 AM   #279 (permalink)
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Check the latest Alpha "nightly" Build no. 6905 (it supposedly has had some Bento work done in it.) : Singularity Viewer Automated Build System
Sorry Lord - I'm super tired today so not sure what you mean. Is this something that's been built with bento included that I should be able to see with my viewer?
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Old 01-12-2017, 04:46 AM   #280 (permalink)
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Ded. It DED.

No seriously, its quite some time since i last heard from any of the Singu Devs and the Source Repository wasn't updated in 5 months either. Although i remember a faint mention that its secretly being worked on still by Liru. NO PROMISES.
I'm tired and cranky but why is it that I feel that any time I post anything about Singularity, you will pop out of the shadows yelling "it rubbish! it not my viewer! you too stupid to understand! it ded! why you so stoopid to not use my viewer?!"

Just shush and go away Nira, please. I'm too tired for your negativity. Just because you haven't heard from the devs for a while, doesn't mean it's 'ded'.
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Old 01-12-2017, 08:49 PM   #281 (permalink)
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Anouk...the changlelog for that build says that they tried to put Bento in, took it back out, and then put it back in...i'm just not sure if it is a full implementation of Bento or not...and just for the record, the Singularity 'team' is also the 'team' behind the Alchemy Viewer, which is sort of their V3 interface style viewer...and that 'team' has been going to the 3rd party dev meetings...so, no, neither viewer is ded nor dead...but the 'Alpha Builds' are the ongoing developmental builds for Singularity...they just don't make them 'Release Builds' until they can establish stability with them...and then it becomes a compilation from the last Release Build to the new Release Build....some viewer makers call their developmental builds 'Alpha', 'Beta', or 'Experimental' builds...it really just means it's their 'Developmental' build while they see if it breaks or has bugs that affect the viewer's stability.
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Old 01-13-2017, 09:45 AM   #282 (permalink)
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Thanks for the info Lord. And I never for a second assumed it was 'ded' - i was quoting Niran with that. I was just pissed off that yet again, he feels the need to stomp into a thread that has nothing to do with his own viewer and poopoo stuff he knows nothing about.
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Old 01-14-2017, 06:10 PM   #283 (permalink)
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Thanks for the info Lord. And I never for a second assumed it was 'ded' - i was quoting Niran with that. I was just pissed off that yet again, he feels the need to stomp into a thread that has nothing to do with his own viewer and poopoo stuff he knows nothing about.
And i'm getting pissed at people like you assuming some bullshit i didn't even write. What the hell? Have you even fucking read what i wrote? Have you? No you didn't. I was being a meme-ster saying oh look its this question again, it's DED of course. Maybe you haven't seen the part about where i say "hey guys jokes aside they haven't updated their repo in 5 months but i heard its still secretly being worked on"

Where am i stomping on Singularity? FYI I like Singularity.

I'm giving out the information i got and the last information i got all point to "it's dead" or at least going to die if its going to continue this road. Also i looked into the repository before writing anything, a commit 5 months ago is pretty much dead by SL's rapid development standards. I don't know of any "in development/experimental" repositories of them, i'm checking this off the official repository which clearly signals "we are dead". On top of that i was told that the development team of Singularity pretty much broke apart mostly and/or is doing other stuff now and going by what Lord said it pretty much sounds like Singularity is in a very bad situation. So there you have it, officially it seems dead with a slight chance that it will suddenly rise out of the shadows at some point. Who knows.

Also, on the topic of my negativity. Ohboy, here we go again. I guess i'm suppose to write some over-enthusiastic optimism bullshit that everything is going to be fine and soon we'll all live in a world with piece. Open your fucking eyes, it's called staying realistic. I neither said the world is going to end nor did i say it's not.

So how about you calm your fucking tits. This is no Firestorm hate thread of mine okay? Go there, hate on me in there, because that's the place i'm stomping on others.

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you will pop out of the shadows yelling "it rubbish! it not my viewer! you too stupid to understand! it ded! why you so stoopid to not use my viewer?!"
drives me bat shit insane. I'm sick of reading it. Where? WHERE do i say "use my Viewer", WHERE do i recommend my own Viewer over others? WHERE? Tell me. I think you need a lesson, the time i have actively or basically even at all recommended my Viewer over anything else is over, it was over when i stopped my old Viewer, why can't you see that? Do you even know that i'm pointing everyone at all the other Viewers (except Firestorm) unless you specifically ask for the Viewer i am using? Did you know that? Even if you ask me specifically about my own Viewer i do not recommend it, not at all, i let people freely choose and more specifically i wait for people to ask me for download links. Did you know that? I bet you didn't, so stop spreading this bullshit.

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Old 01-15-2017, 02:58 PM   #284 (permalink)
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I dislike singu, I think it is stupid and needs to die. I will fault you for liking it. I actually will step out of the shadows and call it rubbish. I also eat babies and new born kittens as it is part of the atkins diet.
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Old 01-15-2017, 10:21 PM   #285 (permalink)
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I dislike singu, I think it is stupid and needs to die. I will fault you for liking it. I actually will step out of the shadows and call it rubbish. I also eat babies and new born kittens as it is part of the atkins diet.
Okay let's be more specific about it: I don't 'like' like the Viewer, i'm fine with its existence. It's more of a 'i think the devs are nice' thing. I actually dislike all Viewer 1's and think their interface should die and all people pissed about V2's interface should simply sit down and do what you do all the time in real life, deal with it. You don't complain that almost every game has a different interface too, right?
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Old 01-16-2017, 03:24 AM   #286 (permalink)
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Actually, I strongly prefer the V1.x interface over that of V2/V3..., simply because it has been WAY more intuitive than the newer interfaces. It actually took me only an hour as a newbie to get the gist of most of the basic functions.

Maybe that's because I never had anything to unlearn while I learned to use the V1.x interface, because I never played any computer games before I joined SL (except for Klondike patience, Sudoku, and Chess)
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Old 01-16-2017, 04:44 AM   #287 (permalink)
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I'm still using Singularity on my tiny netbook. I log in, I IM people and I log out so I don't really need the latest features. I also prefer the v1 interface and I really don't want to change. It's the most practical when you're deep in IM and chat conversations.
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Old 01-16-2017, 06:18 AM   #288 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by eighthdwarf Checchinato;Maybe that's because I never had anything to [I
unlearn[/I] while I learned to use the V1.x interface, because I never played any computer games before I joined SL (except for Klondike patience, Sudoku, and Chess)
There's nothing to unlearn. Most things from V1 can be directly or indirectly taken over to V2+. Also you don't "unlearn" you learn more.

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I'm still using Singularity on my tiny netbook. I log in, I IM people and I log out so I don't really need the latest features. I also prefer the v1 interface and I really don't want to change. It's the most practical when you're deep in IM and chat conversations.
V3 (CHUI) works practically the same as V1 Chat. It's objectively a lot worse than that of V2, tabbed IM is a horrible system when you are "deep in" IM and Chat Conversations. Tabbed IM has been the bane of literally every MMO ever. It's used everywhere and its annoying, extremely prone to errors, wastes a lot of space compared to its actual usefulness (usefulness to space usage ratio). SL's V3 Chat is already an improvement over the V1 Chat (and every MMO ever) as you are able to use small icons only instead of horizontal names (like in MMO's) or even worse vertical name tabs. On top of being a horrible system. the horrible Conversations floater must be open for you to actively, or in this case "inactively" track conversations, what i mean here is that if you are not actively following your conversation window you will soon miss out on IMs, be it a whole new conversation that is not displayed anymore due to the conversation floater being too small or single IM's due to the same reason. The conversation window is a space waste unless you are currently writing in it or reading a really long text, something V2's original chiclet IM system improved massively compared to everything i have seen so far being done in SL and every other MMO i ever played (and i played a lot).

You only had these small group icons or profile icons at the bottom right, giving you a conversation status at a glance, no conversations floater open, no flashing chat button, no extra "conversations" button additionally to the local chat one, no tabbed madness which just supports writing in the wrong tab (i see it happen all the time and i do sometimes do it too but i got used to checking the current conversation again before sending), nothing of all this bug ridden, human mistake supporting bullshit. Whenever a conversation gets an update (IM or Group) the chiclet icon displayed an icon (or in my Viewer it was a thick yellow border) that immediately told you that this conversation had messages you haven't read yet, you could then just click the chiclet, have the conversation as separate floater open immediately above the chiclet, the chatbar focused automatically, you could read and write your answer immediately, send it and turn your attention back to whatever else you did, either another conversation or something inworld, the window automatically hid away until you actually wanted to see that conversation again, ontop of all that you had the obvious chat/IM popups which you could read or click to open the conversation too. It was a massively better system than what V1 had and what V5 has now. Some idiots tho had to complain without actually using it, like they always do and LL promptly changed it, adding the now shitty shiny new "copy" of the V1 system which they call CHUI.

Thanks V1 users for breaking this for us because yes almost exclusively V1 users were complaining and as i said already you didn't even really use it, nor did you use it after they changed it, it's a prime example of how a small vocal part of a large community which's biggest user split is an illiterate bunch of people that are not even willing to put up a bit of extra time to learn a new system that is objectively better, at least as fast to use and more efficient than their previous system, whines about their own inability and somehow manages to get Linden Labs to move their ass and change it for everyone, to an objectively worse system that is just a copy of the first system. Back to the roots, were we threw stones and made weird noises calling it communication.

I hate Firestorm for offering your sorry asses a "V1-like" skin but at the same time i'm sorry for them having to waste their time just to make you happy. Have you even the slightest idea what it means to have full on support for just one single UI? Everything can and will break at any time when you don't expect it, it's a horrible mess with 1 single UI, having 2 completely different ones, or even 3 or more is a nightmare, now add on top translations and we are talking infinite^infinite like numberless numbers. Yet so many of you V1 users remain on your opinion that it is your right to have an interface that you are currently comfortable with causing everyone an indescribable amount of extra work, not just yourself, trying to persist on your opinion, defending it from everyone, everyone who makes a Viewer, everyone who develops and/or changes anything for the Viewer UI as a whole. I can give you a few related numbers just randomly picked out of a Viewer to show you what you have to keep track of somehow:

The viewer has, starting from 1 and ranging all the way up to an theoretically infinite amount of different skins which can include changes to the UI, additionally to textures.
The viewer has by default 12 different languages covered, every single language can technically be seen as an extra skin.
Every language has roughly up to 460+ xml files, each one containing usually one window with partly or all its contents you see in the Viewer.
Every change in the english base UI is carried over to all languages and all other skins unless that skin specifically specifies it differently, which means depending on the skin you might have whole copies of windows lying around that define an entirely different window layout and its contents.
This means that every change in any language or skin overwrites the base UI, you always design the base UI first and all other UI's on top, when you make any change to the base UI, those changes might not be carried over properly depending on the other languages and skins and if they have a replacement defined. This creates the problem of you changing something in the base UI and you theoretically having to check every single skin, every single language and make changes to these as well if necessary.

An example:
I add a button, its 200 pixel wide and 23 pixel high, default, nothing fancy.
Now i add the german translation for it but whoops the german label is too long so now i'm presented with 2 options:
  • A: I go back to the base UI and change it in a way that allows me to label the button properly in both english and german. (which is what i do)
  • or B: I define a new width making the button longer in the german UI only, to allow it to be labeled properly without clipping. (that's what LL does)
Now i change the button as part of a redesign or simple layout change that became necessary because i added another button. Depending on what i chose to do, A or B, i get different results:
  • A: I'm fine and have to make the new design work with both the english and german UI again, like i did the first time around.
  • B: It's fine in the english UI but the german one has a longer button and makes the new button clip out of the window. Now if i don't use the german UI i won't know or notice.
Do you see the problem? The UI becomes increasingly more difficult to maintain with every single line you add, with every single skin you add, with every single texture you change in that skin, with every single language you add or support and so on.

The necessity to explain this has been long overdue.

So next time anyone uses this cheap "i use V1 because UI" excuse again you might want to think about what you are doing, what additional work and trouble you are causing others, including those not associated with the development team you are basically relying on to fix your laziness.


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Old 01-16-2017, 08:12 AM   #289 (permalink)
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Too long, didn't read, but I think you meant to say you want chat to stay out of your way.

That's not what I'm doing. I'm having full paragraph conversations and I don't need to be constantly moving my camera as I would be doing in an MMO. What I do in SL is nothing like gaming.

I don't close the chat window and I don't want an icon or a notification. I want the chat window to stay constantly open.
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Old 01-16-2017, 08:57 AM   #290 (permalink)
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Too long, didn't read, but I think you meant to say you want chat to stay out of your way.

That's not what I'm doing. I'm having full paragraph conversations and I don't need to be constantly moving my camera as I would be doing in an MMO. What I do in SL is nothing like gaming.

I don't close the chat window and I don't want an icon or a notification. I want the chat window to stay constantly open.
You could set it to tabbed. You could undock the window from the chiclets, both would have made the conversation stay unless you specifically redock or minimize it. V2 had something for everyone. You would know if you had used it but that's again exactly what i was talking about. Viewer 2 Sidebar all over again. Did you know Viewer 5 still uses the sidebar just in a perma-undocked state? Did you know the perma-docked state was fixed in 2.1, when literally everyone who complained about it already left? No one seems to see that they have been dancing to your piping all along. People don't give second chances, they bail out immediately on the first failure.

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Old 01-16-2017, 09:08 AM   #291 (permalink)
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Quote:
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....
So next time anyone uses this cheap "i use V1 because UI" excuse again you might want to think about what you are doing, what additional work and trouble you are causing others, including those not associated with the development team you are basically relying on to fix your laziness.

Jeez. tl;dr. Life's too short to trawl through yet another one of your frothing rants. I just managed to grab the last paragraph and seriously - wtf dude?

Yet another rant about how it's the user's fault for being lazy and stupid and blah blah. The TP viewers are out there, so we use them. That makes us stupid and lazy? That makes additional work and trouble for others?? Sometimes, there's just not enough WTF for your posts.

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You could set it to tabbed. You could undock the window from the chiclets, both would have made the conversation stay unless you specifically redock or minimize it. V2 had something for everyone. You would know if you had used it but that's again exactly what i was talking about. Viewer 2 Sidebar all over again. Did you know Viewer 5 still uses the sidebar just in a perma-undocked state? Did you know the perma-docked state was fixed in 2.1, when literally everyone who complained about it already left? No one seems to see that they have been dancing to your piping all along. People don't give second chances, they bail out immediately on the first failure.
Or of course, you could just maybe...oh, I dunno....NOT keep banging on about what people should or shouldn't do and leave them the fuck alone to use whatever viewer they want in whatever manner they want, no? Just a thought, yanno. You don't seem to be able to grasp the concept that different folks want different things from viewers. The functionalities that you consider priorities may not be the same as for others. For some folks, it's the layout. For others, it's different options. So please just back off with the constant yelling and belittling those that don't conform to what YOU consider to be the perfect user. Doesn't make us stupid, lazy or ignorant and I'm getting pretty tired of that inference. And yes, before you fly off the handle again - you have repeatedly both implied and outright stated these opinions. So don't go getting on your huffy bike and accusing me of making things up.

I don't often lose my temper with people here and I don't often call folks out but your ranting is tiresome, and insulting.

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Old 01-16-2017, 11:58 AM   #292 (permalink)
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Well then, this thread sure got fiesty.

When you're working on a viewer used by a huge part of the community, it makes sense to add/keep functionality used by a huge part of the community, such as preferred skins. It's a pretty simple concept to grasp. There's a reason Firestorm is the top dog.

UI changes to accomidate different lengths are not that big of a deal to make. I've never found it hard to find a reasonable middle ground. If people aren't willing to do this, or other things to keep people happy when working on a project intended for the public, then they have no business involving themselves in maintaining such a project in the first place.

If somebody has different preferences, they can just use another viewer, or make their own.
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Old 01-16-2017, 12:03 PM   #293 (permalink)
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Quote:
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The Great Wall of Text
You know, I've tried yours and all the other TPV and typically I'm very interested in what you who make them have to say on the subject. I've read a lot of your responses and never felt compelled to comment... until now.

But FFS Niran, did you really expect anyone to read this? My eyes started to cross after first paragraph. Who has that kind of attention span, especially when reading what amounts to a rant?

FWIW, choosing to use Singularity (which I do on my laptop; it's lightweight and efficient for my needs there...I use FS on my Rig and I like it just fine thanks) doesn't make anyone 'lazy' or whatever.

Quit being a bully about it, and you *are* being one. People like what they like. It's not a personal attack against you and your product. Geezus.
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Old 01-16-2017, 12:27 PM   #294 (permalink)
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There's nothing to unlearn. Most things from V1 can be directly or indirectly taken over to V2+. Also you don't "unlearn" you learn more.
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Old 01-16-2017, 12:39 PM   #295 (permalink)
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[...] V2 had something for everyone. You would know if you had used it but that's again exactly what i was talking about. Viewer 2 Sidebar all over again. Did you know Viewer 5 still uses the sidebar just in a perma-undocked state? Did you know the perma-docked state was fixed in 2.1, when literally everyone who complained about it already left?
Actually, I know that - because I give ALL viewers (the official one, and those on the TPV list, plus Cool VL Viewer) a try, and then I decide which I use further. Or which viewer I can recomment.
After all, I've been a newbie helper since May '08, so I had to know how to use that awful fugly V2 UI as well. And the following ones.

And that sidebar you mention? Worst decision ever, in my opinion. Even that "fixed" one in V2.1. Also that dark fat V2+ UI in general and those confusing chiclets and toasts - I simply can't give the current UI any chance for every-day use... It's objectively more complicated than the sleek V1.x UI, far less intuitive, even far less aesthetic in my opinion

Quote:
People don't give second chances, they bail out immediately on the first failure.
If the failure is big enough, each further chance is a failure in itself.
Tbh, if there hadn't been TPVs with a V1.x UI, then I also would have left SL for good short after the introduction of V2.

And FYI, I don't even consider the "Phoenix Mode" of Firestorm a V1 UI, rather an acceptable compromise. I honestly wish though that the "Phoenix Mode" of Firestorm had the original V1.x look & feel, which is why I often use Singularity or Cool VL Viewer rather than Firestorm.

Last edited by eighthdwarf Checchinato; 01-16-2017 at 01:10 PM.
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Old 01-16-2017, 02:35 PM   #296 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaelissa Cortes View Post
If somebody has different preferences, they can just use another viewer, or make their own.
Sure. I've said that in the past too but the reality is that people are too lazy. Simple as. I'm sure everyone here could somewhat easily make their own Viewer if they just spared some time doing it. I did start with nothing after all, i'm the living proof.

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Originally Posted by Anouk View Post
Jeez. tl;dr. Life's too short to trawl through yet another one of your frothing rants. I just managed to grab the last paragraph and seriously - wtf dude?

Yet another rant about how it's the user's fault for being lazy and stupid and blah blah. The TP viewers are out there, so we use them. That makes us stupid and lazy? That makes additional work and trouble for others?? Sometimes, there's just not enough WTF for your posts.
Sit down, F. You could have actually read the whole thing and tried to understand what i'm trying to say. You didn't, as expected. You could have learned something by reading it, like how much additional work developers put into each Viewer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anouk View Post
I don't often lose my temper with people here and I don't often call folks out but your ranting is tiresome, and insulting.
tiresome and insulting are both subject to your personal opinion and your definition of these. I like reading huge rants. I read all answers although i could just walk by, drop a shitty line and walk away leaving you raging around like you did, maybe you should train to have a bigger attention span.

Speaking of attention span... or the lack of:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellen Cordeaux View Post
But FFS Niran, did you really expect anyone to read this? My eyes started to cross after first paragraph. Who has that kind of attention span, especially when reading what amounts to a rant?
I expect anyone to read it just as i read everyone else's answer, no matter how long. If you are not up to reading it then don't quote it or answer to it and simply ignore it and move on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellen Cordeaux View Post
FWIW, choosing to use Singularity (which I do on my laptop; it's lightweight and efficient for my needs there...I use FS on my Rig and I like it just fine thanks) doesn't make anyone 'lazy' or whatever.
That's fine what you choose, no one's going to stop you. That's not my rant's intend but telling you what amounts of extra work people have to put up with just to make you happy. See it as "you should pay them a lot of respect and be very thankful that they chose to" because it appears like some people think or at least imply that it is their duty and/or part of their "job" to do so at least to some degree as this shows:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaelissa Cortes View Post
When you're working on a viewer used by a huge part of the community, it makes sense to add/keep functionality used by a huge part of the community, such as preferred skins. It's a pretty simple concept to grasp. There's a reason Firestorm is the top dog.

UI changes to accomidate different lengths are not that big of a deal to make. I've never found it hard to find a reasonable middle ground. If people aren't willing to do this, or other things to keep people happy when working on a project intended for the public, then they have no business involving themselves in maintaining such a project in the first place.
No. First of, they don't have to do anything. At all. Not LL nor FS has to do anything you want.
Second, no it is not always. Usage amount has no value at all, you cannot weight a feature/functionality by how much it is used. If there was a legal way of adding infinite money with a Viewer without any repercussions from LL, everyone would use it and quickly LL would go to waste unless they find a different way to make money.
Third, the reason for Firestorms success consists of many individual reasons that weight more or less and ultimately add up. For example: Firestorm being Phoenix being Emerald being whatever came before it, is most likely the biggest part about it's success, now add the snowball effect of mouth propaganda, the infinite circlejerk that advertising (including mouth propaganda) is (you know, something big gets advertised more, making it bigger in turn making them advertise it even more) and their decision to try to make as many people as happy as possible even if it seemingly means creating something you don't like yourself. As a matter of fact 1/3 of the entire SL userbase uses the LL Viewer, comparing this to how successful they are and how much they are praised it simply doesn't add up, if Firestorm was that much of a "top dog" almost everyone would use it because objectively seen it is better than the LL Viewer (which any TPV is, really). There are many people that don't even know that other Viewers exist outside of Firestorm, even after 5+ years of being in SL, sad but true, people get invited to SL by friends and are immediately told to use X Viewer, leaving them no choice, not even telling them about the existence of other Viewers. I consider that manipulation. People manipulate each other.

Also, i'm pretty sure there will be at least one here thinking "oh Niran, you are just pissed that no one uses your Viewer" at some point, because i have seen it being said pretty much all the time, at least once. My answer is "No, but that's easy of you to say" while the actual reason i'm so easily pissed about these kind of topics is a lot more complicated and goes all the way back to understanding how humanity works and evolved over its entire existence.

On topic of public projects. I don't think so. Sharing something public does not mean everyone... or even anyone has to like it. As the leader of your own project it is completely up to you what you want. There have been many projects in the past that turned out to be a hit because the creators did not listen to the community at all and instead pursued their goals.


---

I'm sorry for these wall of texts but can't put all this in 2-3 lines. At least i try to format them somehow to make it more readable.

Last edited by NiranV Dean; 01-16-2017 at 03:26 PM.
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Old 01-16-2017, 05:19 PM   #297 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NiranV Dean View Post
Sure. I've said that in the past too but the reality is that people are too lazy. Simple as. I'm sure everyone here could somewhat easily make their own Viewer if they just spared some time doing it. I did start with nothing after all, i'm the living proof.
Yes you did and SO? In SL as in RL some of us make things for consumption and some of us simply consume. Some of us aren't interested in doing what you did because WE'RE NOT INTERESTED. That makes us lazy how? That makes you superior how? GTFO with that arrogant bullshit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NiranV Dean View Post
I expect anyone to read it just as i read everyone else's answer, no matter how long. If you are not up to reading it then don't quote it or answer to it and simply ignore it and move on
Yeah I'm willing to bet cash money that NO ONE here is willing to read that long ass diatribe word for word.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NiranV Dean View Post
See it as "you should pay them a lot of respect and be very thankful that they chose to" because it appears like some people think or at least imply that it is their duty and/or part of their "job" to do so...
Look. If you're butt hurt because you feel you're not getting the love you should from your viewer consumers too damn bad. You chose to wade into that particular customer service snake pit. Quit slopping your projection all over this thread. You have no idea who actually expresses appreciation to their TPV provider; and a whole damn lot of us go out of our way to.

I'm only half listening to you. Less because of too much text and more because you're just arrogant AF.
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Old 01-16-2017, 06:14 PM   #298 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NiranV Dean View Post
You could set it to tabbed. You could undock the window from the chiclets, both would have made the conversation stay unless you specifically redock or minimize it. V2 had something for everyone. You would know if you had used it but that's again exactly what i was talking about. Viewer 2 Sidebar all over again. Did you know Viewer 5 still uses the sidebar just in a perma-undocked state? Did you know the perma-docked state was fixed in 2.1, when literally everyone who complained about it already left? No one seems to see that they have been dancing to your piping all along. People don't give second chances, they bail out immediately on the first failure.

What I remember is a screen full of unmanageable little windows for each person or group I was chatting with, and a sidebar wasting my small screen.

The only way I could keep a view adequate for the multiple conversations was to cover so much of my screen, that I couldn't see guests arriving.

Again - nothing like gaming. Much more like a super busy IRC channel with a 3D background. This is what *I* do in SL.
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Old 01-16-2017, 07:51 PM   #299 (permalink)
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The only
I mean only
thing keeping Singu from being the perfect viewer is that it doesn't do parcel windlight or use the oxp backup format.

Also Ellen is right, I skipped both walls of text safe in the knowledge that they're just the same old bullshit. "blah blah blah I'm so full of myself blah blah blah" -fuck that noise.
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Old 01-17-2017, 03:18 AM   #300 (permalink)
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It's such a shame that this helpful, and viewer specific thread has gotten crapped up with someone's personal little hissyfit. I have to say that I'm really quite shocked - and that's saying something, considering the crap we're all used to both in SL and here - at the sheer vehemence and vitriol constantly being spewed by a certain individual. And this is far from the first time - in fact - it's a regular thing. This little episode has made me decide that I shall be putting Niran on mute as I don't feel that at any time, in any of the threads we've both participated in, has he been anything but insulting, offensive, condescending and just downright unnecessarily nasty. I'm sick of the patronising venting.

I'm sure his viewer is great, and I know that there are times when he can speak calmly about viewer issues (so long as they're his, obviously), but I've just had enough of this crap. It distracts from the goal of the conversation. I have nothing whatsoever against constructive discussions about viewer types and differences, but this constant stream of abuse is boring and pointless.
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