| Hell is other people
MYOB
Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Zummerzet
Posts: 2,270
SL Join Date: Dec 2006 | Chapter 5 Quote:
12:47] Ciaran Laval: Nika they should nt be selling anymore until the technical issues are worked out. As it stands they are planning to approach owners and discuss the resource issues, this can be done without a price increase
[12:47] xstorm Radek: mainland costs to much now for the little help we ever get
[12:47] Robin Linden: Jorge - I think that's a different situation.
[12:47] Nika Talaj: Of course, Ciaran, but resource utilization is not the only issue.
[12:47] Sindy Tsure: robin, any idea how long a review would take? we talking days, weeks, months?
[12:47] Brunnar Sopwith scratches his head
[12:48] Robin Linden: Sindy, I think this needs to be brought to some resolution quickly.
[12:48] Bob Bunderfeld: With every passing moment Linden Lab loses customers
[12:48] Nika Talaj: (and i agree, stopping to sell them until new policy is in place would be wise)
[12:48] Sindy Tsure agrees, even if only to stop the forums spam..
[12:48] Bradley Palmer: yes i think thats the crux of this, the different levels of use, where some people use their OS to live themselves and build and others who split them into plots to resell or let out as malls with campmasters and sploders and 1 gazillion scripts running full pelt
[12:48] Nika Talaj: (lol, Sindy, yes it is painful)
[12:48] Bob Bunderfeld: I would still like to hear what Responsibility Linden Lab thinks they should take in this?
[12:48] Ciaran Laval: What other issues are there Nika? If they can help people to actually utilise them as a quarter off a full sim I don't see what else needs to be done unless the only solution is to host less per server
[12:49] xstorm Radek: no linden labs is getting the dead wood off the servers that hold them back from growing like they need to grow
[12:49] Nika Talaj: Ciaran, I'm referring to LL's revenue issue with OSRs.
[12:49] Bradley Palmer: thats the big difference and thats why im personally so angry because fair use of 800 prims and 30 scripts for myself now means i have to subsidise people who have abused the system
[12:49] Bob Bunderfeld: Storm, that is too close to the truth I feel
[12:49] Ciaran Laval: but it's only a revenue issue if they need to host less per server
[12:50] Sindy Tsure: isn't that what jack said, ciaran?
[12:50] Robin Linden: Bob, I think it's our responsbility to listen to what everyone is saying.
[12:50] Bob Bunderfeld: So, to be clear
[12:50] Nika Talaj: Ciaran, you may be right, I don't know their revenue model at all. But I could see scenarios where that is not the only factor.
[12:50] Bob Bunderfeld: You don't think Linden lab has ANY responsibility for this problem?
[12:50] Robin Linden: I didn't say that Bob.
[12:50] Bob Bunderfeld: Well, then please, let's get specific
[12:50] Ciaran Laval: They sold a lot of them that surely boosted revenue, unless it has led to a drastic downturn elsewhere
[12:51] xstorm Radek: drop all the RPG thats not helping giving any help to others or making a real pull to SL and help the real people that try to help others not just there own damn pockets
[12:51] Sindy Tsure: though i think bob is a raving lunatic, i agree that this could have gone better.. a "folks, you're abusing OS sims.. knock it off or we'll have to raise prices" blog would have been better
[12:51] Sindy Tsure: *a better start
[12:51] Robin Linden: Bradley, how about load balancing. Some have said that we should provide better statistical info and let Residents work out the resource problem themselves. What do you think about that?
[12:51] Brunnar Sopwith: wow
[12:51] Bob Bunderfeld: YOu all but called your customers "bad boys and girls" in the price increase blog, yet turned a blind head to your own culpability
[12:51] Ciaran Laval: Agreed Sindy ....nobody copy and paste this chat log!!!!
[12:51] Bob Bunderfeld: When will we see an apology?
[12:52] Nika Talaj: Ah, yes, I should have said profit! Reading between the lines of Jack's statements, OSRs are nowhere near as profitable as regular sims. And the regular sim market has been cannibalized by them.
[12:52] Sindy Tsure thinks it's a mistake to limit it to that, nika.. people ARE abusing them
[12:52] Bob Bunderfeld: And the decision to sell those OS's to the customers was whoese/
[12:52] Justice Razor: that's a great idea, I think, robin! let the sim owners solve the problem
[12:52] Ciaran Laval: heh I made that point in July, six weeks before I caved in and purchased an openspace
[12:52] Bob Bunderfeld: ?
[12:52] Chaley May: yes we need to know the details about the resources that the OS sims are taking which is why the costs are needed.. i dobt believe bandwidth alone is a good enough reason
[12:52] Nika Talaj: True, Sindy. The resource issues are real as well.
[12:53] Bob Bunderfeld: If Resource Allocation WAS the problem, you would think Linden Lab would have all these graphs in their Blog showing it
[12:53] Bob Bunderfeld: Why haven't we seen these numbers
[12:53] Nika Talaj: Robin, more information would help, better tools to monitor script load etc. would help.
[12:53] xstorm Radek: at this point there is to many scammers selling to people open space sims when they do not even know what they are buying in to as of yet
[12:53] Robin Linden: Agreed Nika. It always helps to have more information!
[12:54] Sindy Tsure: but you've already said you no longer trust jack, bob.. now you're asking for more data from him?
[12:54] Bradley Palmer: i think some residents will just ignore that and go right ahead and cram everthing they can get into the sim to get as much out of it as they can unfortunately
[12:54] Nika Talaj: Then you could give people much more specific recommendations, as well, Robin.
[12:54] Sindy Tsure: "you're a liar! tell me more!"
[12:54] Robin Linden: Yes xstorm - that's been a big problem. It's easy to cheat people who don't know the difference.
[12:54] Bob Bunderfeld: No, I said, if you listened, that the inforation should have been put in the BLOG when it was said
[12:54] Robin Linden: An option we're looking at is making sure that it's easy to see what type of land you're on so that doesn't happen.
[12:54] Bob Bunderfeld: Now I won't believe it because you can make up whatever numbers you want
[12:55] Bradley Palmer: id appreciate it but then i also wouldnt take the micky and try to set up a mall in a low prim sim
[12:55] Robin Linden: Bob, I suspect it would be pretty hard for us to do anything right in your view.
[12:55] xstorm Radek: Bob a error is still a error
[12:55] Bob Bunderfeld: You are right
[12:55] Bob Bunderfeld: wrong I mean
[12:55] Nika Talaj: Bradley: too true. The people who would monitor their sims are NOT the people abusing them!
[12:55] Ciaran Laval: I like Sindy's idea, I think it was Sindy, tell people to behave or else and give clear guidance
[12:55] Bob Bunderfeld: I would appreciate it if SOMEONE at Linden lab stepped up to the Microphone and too responsiblity for their own mistakes leading to this issue
[12:55] Chaley May: I know that 50k concurrent users will always be somewhere in the grid using up bandwidth and the costs of bandwidth dont increase because of their location
[12:56] Bradley Palmer: ah yes that would help a great deal...then unscrupulous types couldnt bamboozle the uninitiated and sell them something that wasnt suitable
[12:56] Bob Bunderfeld: Then come up wth a Compromise to what you have proposed
[12:56] Bob Bunderfeld: But then again, that would mean Linden Lab did the right thing, and that hasn't happened for almost 3 years now
[12:56] Sindy Tsure: [#VWR-8768] Buy Land dialog should make it obvious if the land is on an openspace region - Second Life Issues and [#VWR-8770] About Land should show openspace vs full and the server class of the host - Second Life Issues are two to vote for RE making it easy to see the sim type
[12:56] Bob Bunderfeld: Now that was the INSULT you were all looking for
[12:56] Ciaran Laval: I thought that was coming Sindy?
[12:56] Nika Talaj: I am puzzled, frankly, as to why hard limits on OSR resouce utilization have not yet been implemented. Is that so hard to do, Robin?
[12:57] xstorm Radek: you can never turn back time to stop a error just learn from the errors you make and move on and try never to make them again
[12:57] Sindy Tsure: neither are assigned, ciaran.. that doesn't mean they're not being worked internally, tho
[12:57] Bob Bunderfeld: You are right, but NOT taking responsiblity for your part of those mistakes isn't the best way to handle business either
[12:57] Ciaran Laval: I thought jack mentioned it in his blog
[12:58] Sindy Tsure: could be.. i've read so much in the last few days, it's starting to leak.. i think.. maybe.. can't remember
[12:58] Nika Talaj: I would think that, for example, monitoring LSL/Mono script load within a single processor would be easy, and you could just clamp those threads when limits are exceeded.
[12:58] Robin Linden: I don't know Nika - I know that we can manage prim use technically. I think it's much hard to manage script load.
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