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Originally Posted by Joseph Worthington  Jeebus Cripes......
First of all, the "hip-hop culture" doesn't hate gay people any more than any other music based culture. At least, not that I can see. I may however be wrong, so please feel free to cite one song by any major band of any genre about the "mansex" that has been a hit. Because I must have completely missed it. I mean c'mon. To associate an entire culture with the actions and antics of a few of the more visible members, whether they be in the media or in one's personal life, is downright....well.....stupid. And more so...offensive. Why?
You say the hip-hop culture hates gay people.
I'm saying I'm a part of the hip-hop culture.
You're then saying that I hate gay people....no?
Sloppy, circular logic I know...but that's the way it sounds to me. I hate being lumped into the fallacy of "These people think this and feel this way". NO!! Some people may think that and feel that way, but that doesn't mean that the culture onto itself does. Is that what's portrayed? Yes. Does that make it true? Fuck no.
Some of the more visible gay stereotypes would lead me to believe that all gays are superficial, chubby hating, clothes whoring, sissy boys. Are some gay people that way? Possibly. Is the entire gay culture that way? Fuck. No. To touch back on one of your original questions...why does no one discuss rap music's effect on society as a whole (paraphrasing).....is because to do so would be to discuss a stereotype's effect on society as a whole. The truth is, it doesn't have an effect on society, but rather on individual's perception of such.
At my last job I had a total of 5 direct co-workers. 3 of them were gay. But as I'm a part of the hip hop culture, I obviously had a problem with them because ohwaitasecondholdthephone ......two of them were lesbians, black, and listened to way more rap music than I do. (Potentially offensive line coming up.) Damn those self hating Dykes. Damn them straight to hell.
Not everyone who listens to rap music shares the mentality you seem to think they do. Same way most people who enjoy Linkin Park are not little namsy pamsy cry babies. Same way not everyone who listens to country is an inbred hillbilly. Same way not everyone who enjoys the old Jazz Standards is some over the hill fogey.
I mean, for a fella who's so concerned with acceptance of your sexuality among a certain group of people, you sure seem rather quick to lay out the blanket statements and judge said same group of people yourself.
Maybe the issue here isn't that hip-hop hates gays....but rather that you hate hip-hop.....and just so happen to be gay.
Of course after all that, I am genuinely curious if Rock, Pop, Punk, Techno, Jazz, or any other music based culture has come out as being openly loving of, or even accepting of gays.
And no I'm not counting Broadway/Showtunes because those are fucking stereotypes. |
Are you going to sit there and try to tell me that hip-hop culture INS'T the most misogynistic out of pretty much any other popular culture? Are you going to try to claim that hip-hop culture treats women with respect? I can't think of a single instance of someone from hip-hop culture treating women with respect, unless that "respect" means giving them lots of diamonds and jewelery and "bling" and things that cost money.
You mentioned older standards for things--there's a reason why you can't think of any NEW scenarios other than hip-hop culture that treats people that way--it's because EVERYONE ELSE LEARNED already that it's wrong to treat people that way. If someone like Sinatra was doing now what he did back then, you BETTER BELIEVE in a quick minute that he would be severely chastised for it. Ever wonder why James Bond movies aren't misogynistic anymore? Gee, I wonder...
As far as bands saying "we love gay people"---NO, it's not going to happen. But mark my words, the people that I see the MOST intolerance of gay people, the people that I see ranking on gay people the most--with the exception of Phelps types--are those who come from that culture.
I make my appearance look the way I do because of gang culture--appearance is the only way without actually trying to act "gangster". The only way I could be more prepared to deal with people like that is if I carried a gun and when I start getting fucked with "faggot" or whatever, I pull it out, shove it in their face, and tell them to shut the fuck up, and that's just not something I'm going to do.
You obviously haven't been the brunt of this sort of thing. You obviously don't know what it's like. I'm tired of living my life in fear of some gangster wannabe making some comment and I can't say something back because they probably pack and/or have their homies right there to beat the shit out of me if I have a problem with something they've said.
What sort of similar thing do you have with gay people? That someone that you're not attracted to might find you attractive? That someone might make a comment about your outfit? What sort of similar FEAR do you have of gay people? DO YOU FEAR FOR YOUR LIFE if you were to make a comment back to them?
I'm tired of it! I'm sick of that culture taking over things. I'm not going to go back to living like gay people had to in the 60's. If it DOES get bad enough where I have to worry just from walking outside my door, I WILL get a firearm. Luckily THAT'S NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN.
I shouldn't have to live in fear. Maybe you don't understand that--oh wait--y'all get it from the police, so instead of realizing how wrong it is, let's just treat everyone else that way so they can be just as scared. It's SHIT! It's a bunch of CRAP!
I'd like to be able to go to a Denny's or any other restaurant and not have to hear the word "GAY" or "faggot" followed by that type of laughter that is forced because if you don't laugh you must be gay, used every 20th word by gangster/hip-hop/rap-loving types.
I don't even hear that kind of stuff from total rednecks that talk about hitting their wives.
If the videos didn't depict what they depict, if the lyrics didn't depict what they depict, I wouldn't be having this conversation because the things that are popular wouldn't be a bunch of misogynistic BS.
Trying to claim that hip-hop culture isn't homophobic or misogynistic is like trying to claim that the culture in Iraq or Iran or Pakistan or Saudi Arabia isn't homophobic or misogynistic. Sure, there are the REALLY RARE people who go against that, but THEY'RE RARE.
I can't think of a single time that I've heard someone in one of those "faggot" conversations say, "Come on now, they're not bad people" or anything like that--it's always laughing with them.
Just like other people have changed, I'm sure that hip-hop can change, but as long as it's SOOOOO focused on being SOOOO different than the rest of society, that they can't be "like the man", that's going to take a long time. A VERY long time.
Let me put it this way: I've purposely hung out at places where one would THINK there'd be a lot of homophobia. I've went to redneck hangouts--I've done it for years to test myself and it just doesn't compare to a matter of minutes around gangster-hip-hop types: I've went to biker bars, trucker hangouts, places that take 40 minutes to drive to that are out in the middle of NOWHERE (I've done this as a test to see if I can pass as not being gay) and I've NOT HEARD ANYTHING that resembles what I hear 9 out of 10 times I go to somewhere with people who resemble the hip-hop culture say in a matter of 15 minutes. Don't try to tell me that hip-hop culture isn't EXTREMELY anti-gay. Being non-masculine is the ultimate in being the bottom of the totem pole when it comes to hip-hop culture.
Can you name A SINGLE gay hip-hop artist? You can't? Why not? I can name TONS of gay artists from other styles--why not HIP HOP? No, I can't name songs that say "I want to screw you in the ass"--or "why can't we treat gay people better", but I can name lots of gay artists.
Category:Gay musicians - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Read it and weep.